explain xkcd - User contributions [en]

2578: Sword Pull

2022-02-08T14:16:54Z

172.68.50.43: it's --> its

{{comic
| number = 2578
| date = February 7, 2022
| title = Sword Pull
| image = sword_pull.png
| titletext = Merlin really shouldn't leave his dirt bike lying around.
}}

==Explanation==
{{incomplete|Created by a DIRT BIKE WITH UNBREAKING II AND CURSE OF VANISHING (I SHOULD REALLY LEARN S.G.A.)- Please change this comment when editing this page. Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}
A surprised [[Cueball]] walks up to a stone where the hilt of a sword is sticking out. The sword thus appears to be stuck in a stone, like {{w|Excalibur}} from the legends of {{w|King Arthur}}. Usually the one that can pull the stone out becomes king of England, see for instance Disney's {{w|The Sword in the Stone (1963 film)|The Sword in the Stone}}. This was featured in [[1521: Sword in the Stone]], where [[Megan]] decides to return the sword back into the stone after reading about {{w|England}} on Wikipedia.

Cueball thus crawls on to the stone and pulls hard yanking it almost out of the stone. But then his surprise is even greater than before, as he finds that the pull of the sword starts a motor inside the stone, and soon after the stone starts moving to the right with Cueball on top. He did not manage to remove the sword from the stone, and after he release it the sword is retracted back to its original position inside the stone.

According to the title text the sword is actually the {{w|rope start|rope starter}} for Merlin's {{w|dirt bike}}. {{w|Merlin}}, a wizard, is typically known as King Arthur's advisor. The title text mentions that Merlin really should not just let his dirt bike lie around, indicating that this is a bad habit. Since rocks are usually not dirt bikes in disguise,{{citation needed}} [[Randall]] may be meaning this literally, as in a stone-bike that travels through the dirt, which appears to be represented in the last panel.

Since Merlin is an ancient person, then if this comic is set today, then maybe it is not really a stone, but rather a pile of dirt that has covered Merlin's old dirt bike. Of course rope starters (and engines) were not invented in Merlin's time{{citation needed}}. However, he was a wizard so who knows what was possible for him.

Some similarly-sized stones, namely {{w|Sailing stones|sailing stones}}, do move spontaneously with up to 0.3 km/h in precise conditions. However, the stone in the comic appears to be moving at a higher speed, and sailing stones require no rope starting{{citation needed}}.

==Transcript==
:[Cueball walks towards a large stone on the ground from which the hilt of a sword is protruding. The ground he walks on is uneven, with small plants growing and small stones lying on the ground.]
:Cueball: ??

:[Cueball stands on the stone and attempts to pull the sword out of the stone using both hands and leaning a bit back away from the sword.]

:[Cueball manages to pull the sword partially out of the stone, still using both hands, and now he is almost standing in full height, but still leaning a bit back. Both he and the sword is vibrating from the effort, as indicated by several sets of two lines around the sword and Cueball's arms. The pull gives off a loud sound, and also a snoring sound comes because of the pull. And three small lines above the right part of the stone indicated that other sounds are coming from the stone]
:Pull: <big><big>''Yank!''</big></big>
:Sword: ''Zzz<big>z</big>z''
:Stone: Put put put
:Stone: Brrrrr<big>rr</big>

:[Cueball is still holding on to the sword, with the tip still inside the stone. But he is not pulling anymore and is now looking down on the stone beneath him. There are now several lines from both sides of the stone indicating noises coming from the stone, which now is written on both sides of Cueball on the stone.]
:Cueball: ?? ??
:Stone:Rrr<big>r<big>rrrrrrrr</big></big>rr

:[Cueball has released the sword which has then returned to the original position deep in the stone. The stone is now clearly moving to the right of the panel, with Cueball on top of it. He is looking behind him and holding his arms out to the side to keep his balance. The patch where the stone lay to start is dark. Four large lines behind the stone indicates how it is moving. The stone is already partially outside the right edge of the panel. The sound from the stone is floating behind the stone as it moves to the right]
:Stone: Rrrr<big>rrrrrr<big>r</big>rr</big>

{{comic discussion}}

[[Category:Comics featuring Cueball]]
[[Category:Fiction]]

Talk:2570: Captain Picard Tea Order

2022-01-20T14:29:06Z

172.68.50.43:

...{{w|Builder's tea|Builders}}. I mean, Picard is French and Trek(/Randall) is 'Merican but I suspect it would still be a valid option to give the Ready-Room replicator... [[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.126|172.70.91.126]] 23:31, 19 January 2022 (UTC)

In ''Star Trek: Picard'', Picard is seen requesting "tea, earl gray, decaf". [[Special:Contributions/172.69.68.202|172.69.68.202]] 03:33, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
:I would call for a {{citation needed}} here. In case you can supply it, put it in the table under defac. --[[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 11:22, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
::I put it in with [https://tvline.com/2020/01/26/star-trek-picard-premiere-easter-eggs-earl-grey-decaf/] as ref. [[Special:Contributions/172.68.50.43|172.68.50.43]] 14:29, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

Presumably infinite tea could be the beverage to accompany [[1099|Endless Wings]]. [[User:Nitpicking|Nitpicking]] ([[User talk:Nitpicking|talk]]) 03:45, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
::This joke should only come on a [[1099: Tuesdays|Tuesday]]! And I'm annoyed you beat me to it ;-) But at leat I found another infinity joke first [[1433: Lightsaber]]. --[[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 11:22, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
:I assumed infinite tea was just a bad pun - as in 'To infinite tea and beyond!' [[Special:Contributions/162.158.159.85|162.158.159.85]] 09:12, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
::[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2VSYmGSJtCA To infinity and beyond] from Toy Story you mean? Good point.--[[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 11:22, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

I showed it to a friend an their response was: "[In early 20th century England] they added condensed beef stock to their tea for breakfast", so ''meaty'' tea is very much a possibility. Then they linked some brand promotional materials for "Vimbos: The Prince of Fluid Beef" and "Vimbos: an ox in a teacup". Because I was just about to sign off for the evening, I'm not going to do the due diligence to research, cite, and edit the main article to reflect this discovery--but I thought it should at least be written here to see if others found it interesting enough to add. [[User:Dextrous Fred|Dextrous Fred]] ([[User talk:Dextrous Fred|talk]]) 04:21, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
:{{w|Bovril|Bovril}} is a standard beef tea [[Special:Contributions/172.70.85.79|172.70.85.79]] 07:40, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
::''Meaty'' is also a term that could be used to describe robustly flavoured teas, such as an Assam. Not likely to be used for Earl Grey, though.[[Special:Contributions/162.158.159.85|162.158.159.85]] 09:18, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
:::Should be added to the explanation... --[[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 11:22, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

The concept of iced tea is not normal, especially as Picard is English. Almost but not quite, totally unlike tea. [[User:Arachrah|Arachrah]] ([[User talk:Arachrah|talk]]) 08:46, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
:Intravenous tea, on the other hand, is an entirely reasonable request. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.159.85|162.158.159.85]] 09:13, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
::But we agree that Icetea is? Could be seen as that. --[[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 11:22, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
:Picard is actually natively, and by name, French. Born not far from the Swiss border, his family running a vinyard there. Though he indeed seems to be quite the Anglophile (steadfastly English by accent!) and we don't entirely know how the (re)merging of Europe may have affected cultural and social inheritances on the other side of the Eugenics Wars (and other civilisation-upturning shifts in terran future-history) from where we are now. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.162.5|172.70.162.5]] 12:45, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

I kind of think that the explanation should give more emphasis to the fact that the whole comic is basically just a convoluted set-up for the Earl Grey joke.[[Special:Contributions/141.101.98.145|141.101.98.145]] 09:20, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
:Agree have just added a line to that affect. --[[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 11:22, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
::Disagree that this was the whole purpose. It's a punchline, but not sure it dictated where it was eventually going. That it goes into it twice (least-normal affix and then the titletext) reads more as stumbling to that conclusion rather than carefully aiming at this particular wham-line. But YMMV. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.86.22|172.70.86.22]] 12:50, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

I disagree that separating the tea into segments would not be possible. You simply need a segmented mug or cup. That would, though, probably prove difficult to drink, unless he used a straw.[[Special:Contributions/141.101.98.145|141.101.98.145]] 09:28, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

While I'm normally the first to jump in on the [citation needed] joke, that would have to be applied to almost every single line of the explanation, so I propose Not Doing That. I accept criticism and counter arguments --[[User:256.256.256.256|Evidently the unfunny person here]] ([[User talk:256.256.256.256|talk]]) 09:45, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
:Great, this has been used way too much. It is often not very funny. And in my opinion should really be used only when citation is needed{{citation needed}} :-p --[[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 11:22, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
::I disagree on that last thing, for that we have {{Actual citation needed}} [[User:256.256.256.256|256.256.256.256]] ([[User talk:256.256.256.256|talk]]) 12:31, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

Could the "infinite" also be a reference to the paperclip maker thought experiment - the replicator will consume the universe to get raw materials and energy to make more and more tea. [[Special:Contributions/141.101.98.225|141.101.98.225]] 10:09, 20 January 2022 (UTC)
:Definitely a problem with a machine that makes thing out of energy, is that is need lots of energy. --[[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 11:22, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

I liked "verbose". Most software run from a command line has a "-verbose" or "-v" option which causes it to give more information about what it's doing, usually useful for the purpose of debugging. Rather than providing more information about the tea, I expect that "tea, earl grey, verbose" would result in the replicator giving a step-by-step explanation as it looks up the recipe for tea, selects appropriate raw materials (does it use particles from the air or something?), begins replicating, finishes replicating, and tests that the final product is within normal parameters. Of course, this might mean that the replicator runs more slowly while doing this; which could be useful if he's getting tea as an excuse to take a break from an argument of some kind. Perhaps the replicator even has a 'traditional' tea making mode, where it pauses and describes a more conventional method of tea-making as if there were an invisible chef with a kettle and a teapot somewhere just out of sight. [[User:Angel|Angel]] ([[User talk:Angel|talk]]) 11:07, 20 January 2022 (UTC)

2570: Captain Picard Tea Order

2022-01-20T14:28:22Z

172.68.50.43: /* Other Words */ Tea, Earl Grey, decaf

{{comic
| number = 2570
| date = January 19, 2022
| title = Captain Picard Tea Order
| image = captain_picard_tea_order.png
| titletext = We can ask the Earl for his order once he's fully extruded from the dispenser.
}}
*This was the fifth comic to come out after the [[Countdown in header text]] started.

==Explanation==
{{incomplete|Created by EXTRUDED EARL GREY- Please change this comment when editing this page. There would be way too many additional [[285: Wikipedian Protester|citations needed]] for it to work here. Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}
Captain {{w|Jean-Luc Picard}} is the captain of the starship ''USS Enterprise'' in the TV series ''{{w|Star Trek: The Next Generation}}''. {{w|Earl Grey tea}} is a beverage that he requests many times in the series, with the exact phrase "[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iaAT6-dY1QI Tea. Earl Grey. Hot.]"

[[Randall]] is parodying this expression with [[#Other Words|other words]] that could follow "Tea. Earl Grey.", starting from ones considered "normal" moving to those presumed increasingly "less normal" down a long and winding arrow.

The machine that Picard is using is a {{w|Replicator (Star Trek)|replicator}}, which can create objects (typically food and drink) according to a pre-programmed pattern, such as Picard's requested Earl Grey tea. In principle, almost anything can be ordered, so some might consider it a bit boring that it is always just tea. And always hot. But for Picard, this is presumably a constant comfort to punctuate what can often be a far from routine job.

When Picard orders his usual tea, other qualifying options are illustrated, as if upon a list or submenu that might be displayed for those that need a hint - though Picard is usually focused upon his more frequent choice when giving the voice command.

Then results of two examples from the normal/less-normal scale are also illustrated: Sticky tea and loud tea. Sticky is kind of obvious, though perhaps not immediately understandable, but the loud version is a tea that screams "Teeee..." The vibrating and screeching teacup may be a reference to the various ''Star Trek'' episodes about {{w|tribble}}s, which behave in a similar way in the presence of Klingons.

The very last qualifying addition, the least normal is not a single word but "Tea for him, too." This reinterprets the meaning of the standard introductory words, such that the replicator has produced a plain (unspecified) tea as well as an actual "Earl Grey", like a living person (either one of the {{w|Earl Grey}}s or a person named Grey with the given forename of Earl). Picard has on purpose ordered tea for himself, followed by a person called Earl Grey, and then queues up a further tea to serve to this newly created person.

In contrast to the often trivial use of a replicator as merely a potentially infinitely versatile vending-machine, the comic sets up a number of quite esoteric options, culminating in Earl Gray himself potentially drinking (generic) tea, after both the tea and he have been replicated into existence by Picard.

In the title text, someone tells Picard that they should wait until the Earl has been fully extruded from the dispenser, and ''then'' ascertain what he would actually wish to drink. The presumption is that it could obviously take some time to get a full person (living) out of the replicator. However, where the replicator can create other things than food (e.g. spare parts), it is {{w|Replicator_(Star_Trek)#Origins_and_limitations|stated in the series}} that it cannot create living things as the precision of the molecular assembly process is too low (and the dispensing aperture used for the materialisation may also be too restrictive) so this order would certainly not be canonically possible.

===Other Words===
{| border =1 width=100% cellpadding=1 class="wikitable"
! Word !! Explanation
|-
| Hot
| A fairly normal word to be used when ordering tea. Although that it even needs specifying is itself a clue that other variations (such as "Iced", below) are available. This is the chosen word of the five words Picard is thinking about in the first drawing. The act of requesting this is thus illustrated, though not of the appearance of the tea itself.
|-
| Iced
| {{w|Iced Tea}} is a 'normal' variation of tea.
|-
| Decaf
| Traditional teas (from {{w|Camellia sinensis}}) tend to have caffeine in them. Asking for {{w|Decaffeination|decaffeinated}} tea is not particularly uncommon if the drinker requires it. In the series ''Picard'', set several decades after ''The Next Generation'', Picard does actually order "Tea, Earl Grey, decaf" in one scene.<ref>https://tvline.com/2020/01/26/star-trek-picard-premiere-easter-eggs-earl-grey-decaf/</ref>
|-
| Good
| A normal, subjective term. Most people drinking tea would want it to be good, but to specify it like this would perhaps be strange.
This is one of the words in the first drawing, as a listed alternative to Hot.
|-
| Lukewarm
| While this is a temperature that tea can be at, most people do not want their teas to be lukewarm.
|-
| Tasty
| Similar to good, most people would want their tea to be tasty, or at least flavorsome.
|-
| Boiled
| Boiling the water used to make the tea is a common and normal way to increase the flavor and nutrients extracted from the tea leaves, though it is suggested that the actual ideal temperature of hot water is 75-98°C (167-210°F), according to whether it is a light tea or a dark one, and that perhaps it should be sipped at around 65°C/150°F-ish if desired 'hot'.
Having made a tea and ''then'' bringing it back to the boil (especially after adding milk/etc) may destroy some of the desirable qualities previously imbued.
|-
| Watery
| Tea is a drink that often involves water, but this perhaps suggests over dilution or under infusion in some way.
|-
| Sour
| Many people do not enjoy a sour taste, which can accompany rot and is a strange thing to specify when ordering Earl Grey tea. Although lemon juice is often an additive used in the same way (but as a complete alternative) to milk.
|-
| Meaty
| Most teas are plant-based.
|-
| Solid
| Tea is usually drunk as a liquid. It would be strange to ask for solid tea.
|-
| Dry
| Tea is a liquid typically made with water and may have milk. A dry version might be either unmade (e.g. tea leaves in their un-infused form) or freeze-dried back into a dehydrated form.
("Dry" can also be used to describe {{w|Dryness (taste)|astringent varities of wine}} ''or'' {{w|Prohibition|enforced alcohol-free scenarios}}. For either option, it assumes a default serving with an {{w|Hot_toddy#Variations|alcoholic component}}, or an entirely {{w|Long Island iced tea|alternate basis}} for the beverage, which the request needs to be specify it is not.) This is one of the five words Picard is thinking about in the first drawing.
|-
| Raw
| This describes tea that has not been "cooked", so it would just be tea made with room-temperature water. This is {{w|Iced_tea#Sun_tea|possible}} but generally takes many hours.
|-
| Deep-fried
| Tea is not usually deep-fried. But you'll probably {{w|Deep-fried Mars bar|find someone}} who has tried it, [https://www.pitco.com/blog/deep-fried-liquids-trend one way or another].
|-
| Sticky
| Perhaps significantly dehydrated, or thickened with enough of a hydrophilic substance, this would produce something very unlike most teas that would usually be requested.
This scenario is illustrated to show a clearly messy product that awkwardly sticks to and drips from the replicator as well as Picard.
|-
| Grilled
| Tea is not usually grilled.
|-
| Fossilized
| Since tea is a liquid, it would be tricky to figure out how to fossilize it.
|-
| Magnetic
| Tea is not magnetic. Magnetic metals would have to be added to the tea, which would not be pleasant to drink.
|-
| Ballistic
| Usually, the replicated beverage is deposited in a stationary cup, but Picard could ask for it to be dropped or thrown out instead.
|-
| Unstable
| This word is often used to refer to radioactive or explosive materials, which hopefully is not a property that would apply to something meant to be ingested. Alternatively, this could imply that the receptacle into which the tea is delivered should be unstable - being unbalanced, or lacking a flat bottom. This is likely to lead to the tea being spilled.
|-
| Blessed
| Tea is a beverage, and it may be strange to ask a machine to create 'blessed' tea.
In role-playing games, items can be Blessed, i.e. having greater positive or lesser negative effects. This includes potions, a class of drinks that do not usually include any teas but could contain the "potion of water", which may therefore be the basis of this blessed brew.
|-
| Blurry
| Being blurry is not a normal state for tea to have.
|-
| Loud
| While molecules in tea (especially hot tea, and vitally so in an {{w|The Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy (novel)|Infinite Improbability Drive}}) do move vigorously, this does not usually result in distinct audible effects.
However, as illustrated, it seems the requested cup of tea is produced capable of emitting a high-pitched, high-volume whining sound that entirely dominates the vicinity. It actually appears to somewhat vocalise what it is, Teeeee...
|-
| Virtual
| Virtual tea cannot be produced physically, so asking a physical tea machine for it would be very strange.
|-
| Intravenous
| This means the tea would be injected directly into the customer's veins, likely a very painful experience if the tea comes out boiling. Instrument of choice would probably be a {{w|Infuser|''tea infuser''}}.
|-
| Expanding
| In a sense, most hot tea is expanding: as the water in the tea evaporates, it becomes much less dense, increasing in "size".
But most people would probably argue that the evaporated water is no longer part of the tea. Water, like most materials, usually expands as it increases in temperature—except between freezing and about 4° C, where it has the unusual property of {{w|Water_%28molecule%29#Density_of_water_and_ice|''contracting slightly''}} as temperature increases. If tea behaves similarly despite the extra dissolved compounds, then "expanding tea" would describe any tea between 4° C and boiling point. Possibly beyond, and explosively so, if {{w|Superheating|superheated}} and then nucleating points are introduced.
|-
| Ironic
| How tea could be ironic is a mystery.
|-
| Segmented
| Tea is usually served in a cup. It tends to stick together and form one liquid. Separating the tea into segments would not be possible.
|-
| Verbose
| This describes using lots of words and language, and would not likely be used for tea, because it cannot speak. Command-line computer programs often run in a 'silent' mode without displaying every step of what happens on the screen. Such programs may have a {{w|Verbose mode|''-verbose'' parameter}} that disables the silent mode. As the replicator is run by a computer, the verbose parameter could be applied to the process of tea-making, with the replocator providing an info-dump on the molecular arrangement of the tea, together with the cup of liquid.
|-
| Cursed
| As with "Blessed", above, items can be Cursed in role-playing games, i.e. having greater negative or lesser positive effects; while there are strategic uses for Cursed items, generally the player would prefer uncursed ones (neutral or blessed). Amongst the curseable items are potions, a class of consumables that do not usually include any teas but does contain the "potion of water", which may therefore be the cause of this cursed cuppa.
Cursed items have featured in xkcd previously: [[2332: Cursed Chair]], [[2376: Curbside]], and [[:Category:Cursed Connectors]].
|-
| Unexpected
| By definition, Picard is asking for tea, expecting it promptly. Perhaps the request for it to be "unexpected" would cause it to be delivered at an unknown time in the future, or to have some alteration.
|-
| Bipedal
| Tea does not walk. This would be a very strange term to use when describing tea.
|-
| Afraid
| Tea does not have feelings. Although [https://www.quotes.net/mquote/901305 water may consider some things to be unpleasant].
|-
| Infinite
| The scope of this request is unclear. It could mean endless production (a steady stream of tea, without obvious limits so long as servicing the request remains practical) or an instantaneous production of an infinite volume of tea (possibly more immediately shown to be flawed in its method of execution). Either could result in an infinitely ''dense'' tea (eventually?), but this may no longer be {{w|No-hair theorem|identifiable as tea}} so might be one of the less practical options, even amongst those on this list.
Indeed, Randall ranks it as the least 'normal', except for just ''one'' further named order.
|-
| Tea for him, too
| {{w|Earl Grey tea|Earl Grey}} is a tea blend.
Taken along with the title text, this Replicator order is for "Tea" (not otherwise qualified), a replicated version ''of'' the Earl Grey (one or other of those {{w|Earl Grey|of that name}}, possibly the {{w|Charles Grey, 2nd Earl Grey|2nd Earl}} for whom the tea blend was supposedly named) and a second such beverage for him to later drink. See more in the [[#Explanation|explanation]] above regarding the title text
|-
! colspan="2" | Words Picard thinks about in the first drawing, but which where not included as labels on the line
|-
| Cold
| Like Iced tea, asking for cold tea is a relatively normal request.
|-
| Pink
| Earl grey is usually an orange-brown color, not pink.
|}

==Transcript==
:[At the top of the panel there is a large caption covering two lines with a subcaption below in a normal sized font:]
:<big>Other words Captain Picard tried at the end of his tea order before settling on "hot"</big>
:From most normal to least

:[Bellow this we see Picard, drawn bald except for a bit of hair near his ears and behind his head. He stands next to a machine, that is a standing rectangle of the same dimensions as Picard. In the front there is an opening around the middle, a dispenser from where the ordered items can be retrieved. There is a label at the top of the machine. Picard is giving a command to the machine. His first three words are clearly spoken out as they stand, but then at the end of the sentence, in stead of just adding one more word, there is a list of five words in a column between two gray lines. Five words are visible, but the top and bottom words are fading out, presumably other words are above and below, but no longer visible. All except the middle are gray. The middle word is placed as the direct follow up to the first three words in the sentence Picard speaks out, and this word is black like the previous three words. So this middle word is clearly the one he actually speaks out. The others where options, presumably on his mind.]
:Label: Replicator
:Picard:
Good.
Cold.
Tea. Earl Grey. Hot.
Dry.
Pink.

:[To the left of the machine a long arrow begins snaking it's way to wards the bottom, where it ends in an arrow pointing down towards the bottom of the panel. At the top there is a broad and thick bar from which it start. Beneath this there are several ticks, the first three are close together and on a part of the arrow that goes almost straight down. But then the arrow curves in under the drawing of Picard, and goes over another drawing of him, placed in a captioned frame. The arrow goes around this and up on the other side, where it goes around another drawing of Picard in a similarly captioned frame. After having gone around this frame it goes a bit up before turning almost straight down before the final arrow head that points down. In total there are 36 labeled ticks on the arrow, see labels below. The ticks have very varying distance between them. There are especially long between them around the first panels with Picard, but closer together at the start and towards the very end. Above the top bar from where the arrow starts there is also a label and just below this and to the left of the long arrow is a smaller arrow pointing down in the direction of the long arrow. This small arrow has a label at its starting point.]
:Bar label: Normal
:Small arrow label: Less normal

:[The second drawing of Picard, shows him standing next to the labeled machine. Picard is this time holding a cup, with sticky lines connecting his hands and the machine to the cup. He clearly looks down at the cup rather than on the machine, as the hair behind his ear is turned differently than the first drawing, where he looks straight towards the machine. Above is a label inside a frame overlaid on the top line of the panel, with what Picard ordered:]
:"Tea. Earl Grey. Sticky."
:Label: Replicator

:[The third drawing of Picard, only displays him and not the machine. He is holding a vibrating cup in both hands, and has now turned the other way, away from where the machine was in the previous drawings (again clearly seen by his hair). Very large letters are displayed in three lines behind him to the exclusion of all else. Four of the 15 letters are partly hidden behind the panels frame, and seven of them are partly covered by Picard. Above is a label inside a frame overlaid on the top line of the panel, with what Picard ordered:]
:"Tea. Earl Grey. Loud."
:Teacup: <big>'''Teeeeeeeeeeeeee'''</big>

:[Words on the arrow from start to finish:]
:Hot
:Iced
:Decaf
:Good
:Lukewarm
:Tasty
:Boiled
:Watery
:Sour
:Meaty
:Solid
:Dry
:Raw
:Deep-fried
:Sticky
:Grilled
:Fossilized
:Magnetic
:Ballistic
:Unstable
:Blessed
:Blurry
:Loud
:Virtual
:Intravenous
:Expanding
:Ironic
:Segmented
:Verbose
:Cursed
:Unexpected
:Bipedal
:Afraid
:Infinite
:Tea for him, too

{{comic discussion}}

[[Category:Star Trek]]
[[Category:Food]]

Talk:2347: Dependency

2022-01-14T20:05:54Z

172.68.50.43: /* Log4j Zero-Day Vulnerability Incident */

I worked for the Linux Foundation on the Core Infrastructure Initiative supporting OpenSSL and other projects. The one that scared me was Expat the XML parser maintained by two people on alternate Sunday afternoons assuming no other distractions. We did get funding for a test suite. Joe Biden was a supporter of LF and CII and was going to host a fund raiser for us at the White House until a perverse result.[[Special:Contributions/141.101.98.222|141.101.98.222]] 22:46, 17 August 2020 (UTC)

:Are you trying to tell me that Biden and Harris weren't for CALEA, DIETYBOUNCE, and similar backdoors just like all the feds? When will they discover how to stop sending money overseas? https://blog.risingstack.com/controlling-node-js-security-risk-npm-dependencies/ [[Special:Contributions/172.69.34.18|172.69.34.18]] 07:37, 25 August 2020 (UTC)

In the explanation, is "far from the days of backwards compatibility" a reference to something specific? I thought quite a few things made today were still backwards compatible, or am I mistaken? [[User:Zowayix|Zowayix]] ([[User talk:Zowayix|talk]]) 18:26, 30 August 2020 (UTC)

== Relevance of Imagemagick? ==

Could someone perhaps add to the explanation an explanation of how this applies to Imagemagick (as mentioned in the title text)? —[[Special:Contributions/108.162.219.174|108.162.219.174]] 22:58, 17 August 2020 (UTC)
:I don't use it myself, but it is a very versatile standalone utility that does a lot through command-line (batched) processing or can be accessed through actual API interface (I use GIMP tools that way, in automation, when not using it directly as a manual interface, but I understand there's a lot of love out there for IM). There's potentially untold uses for that, hidden in the background of other applications. If it disappeared or changed in just the wrong way, could perhaps half the CAPTCHA dialogues suddenly break? Could a self-driving car company find its vehicles are suddenly blind? We might suddenly have so many fewer Doge memes! (Wow! Much up-to-datedness! So topical!).
: In Randall's (or his characters') world, that is. In our world, I see someone mentioned Leftpad in the Explanation, which probably needs more Explanation (or else wikilinking) but is an interesting thing that actually happened in our world, albeit not ''quite'' armagg3don for society... [[Special:Contributions/162.158.154.131|162.158.154.131]] 23:22, 17 August 2020 (UTC)
: Imagemagick is the de-facto standard for Image processing. Since the 90's engineers were either adding support for new formats to ImageMagick or adding new language bindings for ImageMagick. This resulted in a single library that is available on almost every server and desktop platform and can read and write almost every image format. Using imageMagick is sometimes unwieldly. e.g. on nodeJS it actually spawns a sub-process to run imagemagick. But it is still the de-facto (and the only practical) choice in most cases.--[[User:Deepjoy|Deepjoy]] ([[User talk:Deepjoy|talk]]) 00:24, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
:: I would put emphasis on the "almost every image format" ... there are lot of alternative image libraries, but most only support handful of formats (often just jpeg, png and gif). Meanwhile, I suspect not even Gimp supports as many formats as ImageMagick ... and, of course, Gimp is not really usable as library OR for shelling-out. -- [[User:Hkmaly|Hkmaly]] ([[User talk:Hkmaly|talk]]) 23:43, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
::: The massive reliance on ImageMagick was recognized in 2002 by the developers of {{w|GraphicsMagick}} who needed to guarantee a stable version of ImageMagick and created their own fork. So while almost everyone uses and depends on ImageMagick (or think they are using ImageMagick when they are actually using GM) there is an actively maintained alternative. -- [[Special:Contributions/162.158.159.48|162.158.159.48]] 17:10, 21 August 2020 (UTC)

== from the late 2010s onwards? ==

I'm pretty sure re-use and modularization was a thing long before then. Maybe it got more popular in the 2010s, but it's been around since at least the '70s.
: The ideal of reusable code libraries has been around for nearly ever, but except for some popular Fortran statistics libraries I don't think it achieved widespread achievement until much later, e.g. CPAN. [[User:Barmar|Barmar]] ([[User talk:Barmar|talk]]) 03:25, 18 August 2020 (UTC)p

The timezone database (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tz_database#History) has been around since 1986. libc in various forms has been around as long as C has. Reuse and modularity is a fundamental principle of software engineering, and not an invention of the last few years. I'd just remove any mention of date.
: I think it's relatively recent that you can delete a file from one Web server and everything on the internet breaks. Dependencies are one thing, dependency on live updated resources is new. Because it's rather a bad idea. Incidentally overall... I think today's comic needs to be explained slower. Most people in the world are very unfamiliar with these concepts. Although coronavirus responses have taught a lot of us about "supply chains" that put stuff into shops for us to buy. Robert Carnegie rja.carnegie@excite.com [[Special:Contributions/141.101.69.87|141.101.69.87]] 10:18, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

:: While libc in various forms has been around as long as C has, it was never SINGULAR. Every version of C compiler had it's own version of C library maintained by different people. Even now there are alternatives to GNU libc. The timezone database might be better example. Also, reuse and modularity is fundamental principle, but reusing code maintained by someone else in project with bigger staff than that of such code is relatively recent. -- [[User:Hkmaly|Hkmaly]] ([[User talk:Hkmaly|talk]]) 23:48, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

[https://www.ardmediathek.de/video/aktuelle-stunde/angeklickt-sicherheitsluecke-in-log4shell/Y3JpZDovL3dkci5kZS9CZWl0cmFnLWNhOWUzZWE5LWU1NmEtNGRiOC04OWEzLTZhZWE1MTNhMmU0Nw/ German Television] referencing this comic to illustrate the Log4j dependency (at around 1:11)

== This has happened before ==

It may be worth mentioning a case where this actually happened, like https://www.theregister.com/2016/03/23/npm_left_pad_chaos/ [[Special:Contributions/141.101.97.101|141.101.97.101]] 01:03, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
: That was only a problem for those who tried to compile against network versions, instead of having a local copy. One of the dumbest and laziest things you can do as a programmer. Not to mention that you could just copy the code directly into one of your files or just writing your own routine. [[User:SDSpivey|SDSpivey]] ([[User talk:SDSpivey|talk]]) 02:04, 20 August 2020 (UTC)
:: Speaking as a SecDevOps person, another risky thing programmers do out of ignorance is host static local copies of code repositories without a good update and security review plan to make sure the static copy gets regular testing and updates as security and bugfixes are published to the source. Still another risk is writing your own library to reinvent the wheel and making the same mistakes the maintainer of the wheel solved six major versions ago. I would be careful throwing terms like "dumb" and "lazy" around. Every one of those solutions, including your proposals, *also* can be risky if implemented without proper expertise and forethought. There is no 'best' practice here, just risks and advantages that make it so that there is no single one-size-fits-all solution [[Special:Contributions/108.162.212.145|108.162.212.145]] 13:30, 27 August 2020 (UTC)

One particularly big risk that instantly came to mind is the timezone database, which is maintained by volunteers yet underpins basically everything: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tz_database#Maintenance

I remember hearing about this a few years back at a Linux Foundation conference - the NTP daemon was underfunded (as I recall) and the one person maintaining it was struggling to pay bills. Losing NTP breaks an awful lot of things.... [[Special:Contributions/162.158.107.167|162.158.107.167]] 19:48, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

: I see this was [https://www.infoworld.com/article/3144546/time-is-running-out-for-ntp.html problem in 2016] ... I'm not able to find any update on the situation ... -- [[User:Hkmaly|Hkmaly]] ([[User talk:Hkmaly|talk]]) 00:10, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

:: [https://twit.tv/shows/floss-weekly/episodes/350 Nice long interview with Harlan Stenn, author/maintainer of NTP]. [[User:RandalSchwartz|RandalSchwartz]] ([[User talk:RandalSchwartz|talk]]) 05:56, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

: I work with a E100k robot that keeps breaking on account of [[http://atomicparsley.sourceforge.net/ Atomic Parsley]]. Everyone is very amused at this [[User:Kev|Kev]] ([[User talk:Kev|talk]]) 13:32, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

== Some random person in Nebraska ==

Is the reference to a random person in Nebraska totally arbitrary, or is it a reference to someone in particular?

Also, it would be good to have examples of heavily used projects with very small (especially one person) maintainer teams. OpenSSL definitely comes to mind, from what I have read. [[User:Stevage|Stevage]] ([[User talk:Stevage|talk]]) 01:49, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

Nebraska came up in 1667, "Algorithms" as well.[[Special:Contributions/162.158.79.33|162.158.79.33]] 02:22, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
:Nebraska is... Well, I'm sure some Nebraskonians might have a more fully-fleshed out and accurate opinion of its subtleties, depth of culture(s?) and Deity-given geographic artisanship but viewed from further afield it is one of the contenders for "miles and miles of not much going on", or similar, peopled by people that largely live within that promise.
:It may be just a [https://wiki.lspace.org/mediawiki/Power_Cable meme of such a generality], as a brief look at a {{w|List_of_people_from_Nebraska|list of people from Nebraska}} tends to support the hypothesis that the ones who became significant (Astair, Brando, Carson...) probably did so only once they left.
:OTOH, there are (at least) four computing pioneers/developers mentioned among them, creator or authors of significant 'products', and maybe {{w|Sketchpad|one of these}} matches the (intellectual) dependency meme quite well - other than being written in Massachusetts. Or {{w|Blogger_(service)|this one}}, though that might have been LA-baked, maybe?
:I learnt [[1053|some interesting things]] when investigating this issue, just now. Cheers! [[Special:Contributions/108.162.229.142|108.162.229.142]] 09:54, 18 August 2020 (UTC)
:I feel like Nebraska is mentioned just because ot's the.most flyover-sounding flyover state name? Or is it actually home to some well known library maintainer? {{unsigned|162.158.119.199}}
:Another good example might be left-pad. It actually caused a big issue [https://www.theregister.com/2016/03/23/npm_left_pad_chaos/ in 2016] when the developer took it offline and a whole bunch of projects and websites broke. [[User:Numbermaniac|Numbermaniac]] ([[User talk:Numbermaniac|talk]]) 07:41, 22 August 2020 (UTC)

== Microservices reference ==
Microservices reference is not related to this comic, as ImageMagick is monolith application. Also microservices are way of operating and deploying web services, not utility apps.
[[Special:Contributions/162.158.103.177|162.158.103.177]] 07:56, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

:ImageMagick is a library. -- [[User:Hkmaly|Hkmaly]] ([[User talk:Hkmaly|talk]]) 23:50, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

== The Thirty Million Line Problem ==
See [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kZRE7HIO3vk The Thirty Million Line Problem]. Randall's drawing looks like a house of cards on the verge of collapse. In the video, Casey talks about how the lack of a "hardware ISA" causes critical software (like OS'es and browsers) to bloat like crazy (a "hardware ISA" would be a standard for how hardware works, just like the x86 ISA is a standard for how an x86 CPU works, that both AMD and Intel agrees on). Also, he mentions how fragile and broken software is due to this "Thirty Million Line" bloat.
[[Special:Contributions/162.158.107.167|162.158.107.167]] 19:48, 18 August 2020 (UTC)

:Based on [https://www.reddit.com/r/programming/comments/8iyqk9/the_thirty_million_line_problem/ related discussion], that's a VERY bad video: he may have a point, but it takes VERY long time before he gets to it. I'm not going to watch it that long myself. -- [[User:Hkmaly|Hkmaly]] ([[User talk:Hkmaly|talk]]) 00:03, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

:This reminds me of that old joke: If carpenters built buildings the same way programmers made programs, the first woodpecker that came along would destroy civilization.

: I thought the drawing looks more like the [[w:Jenga|Jenga]] game, except the components are not simple rectangles. [[User:Barmar|Barmar]] ([[User talk:Barmar|talk]]) 16:31, 20 August 2020 (UTC)

== "Famous" Left Pad Incident ==
The "famous" left-pad incident in JavaScript's package manager could use some elaboration for those of us for which it isn't. [[Special:Contributions/162.158.107.89|162.158.107.89]] 02:42, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

== Log4j Zero-Day Vulnerability (CVE-2021-44228) Incident==
On December 9, 2021, security researchers discovered a flaw in the code of a software library used for logging. The software library, Log4j, is built on a popular coding language, Java, that has widespread use in other software and applications used worldwide. This flaw in Log4j is estimated to be present in over 100 million instances globally. If exploited, could permit a remote attacker to execute arbitrary code on vulnerable systems.

== Loadsharers ==
There is an initiative by Eric Raymond targeted specifically to mitigate this problem. 
Article: https://www.linuxjournal.com/content/loadsharers-funding-load-bearing-internet-person 
Website: https://esr.gitlab.io/loadsharers/ &emsp; — [[User:Smartchair|Smartchair]] ([[User talk:Smartchair|talk]]) 16:20, 19 August 2020 (UTC)

==NTP==
The [https://www.informationweek.com/it-life/ntp-harlan-stenn-and-an-uncertain-future-readers-react/d/d-id/1319521 Network Time Protocol] is also a great example. --[[User:Slashme|Slashme]] ([[User talk:Slashme|talk]]) 21:50, 19 August 2020 (UTC)