explain xkcd - User contributions [en]

1755: Old Days

2016-11-04T21:39:10Z

Marklark: Hairbun agreed, "Yeah" -- so it's not an explanation

{{comic
| number = 1755
| date = November 4, 2016
| title = Old Days
| image = old_days.png
| titletext = Lot of drama in those days, including constant efforts to force the "Reflections on Trusting Trust" guy into retirement so we could stop being so paranoid about compilers.
}}

==Explanation==
{{incomplete|More explanation required on computer programming. Fill out the explanation column in the [[#Table of statements|table]] that lists all the statements.}}
This comic is showing a conversation between (young) [[Cueball]] and (old) [[Hairbun]] about computer programming in the past, specifically the {{w|compilers}}. Cueball, having a faint idea of just how difficult and byzantine programming was "in the old days", asks Hairbun to enlighten him on the specifics. Hairbun promptly seizes the opportunity to screw with his head.

While her initial agreement that code needed to be compiled for multiple architectures is correct, Hairbun's claims rapidly grow ridiculous to the point where the improvement from {{w|C (programming language)|C}} to {{w|C++}} was that C++ finally supported {{w|floppy disks}} but just punched holes in them rather than using {{w|punch cards}} "like C used". (A notch in the side of 5.25" floppy disks indicates when the disk could be written. Though many floppy disks were intended to have only a single side with data, many people used a hole punch to notch the opposite side of the disk, allowing a drive to write data to the other side of the disk in a single sided drive.)

Hairbun tells Cueball a tall tale about how hard it was back in the '''old days''', making it sound like some of the programming languages used today (C, C++) were written on punch cards and that you had to ship your code in the mail to a computer company ({{w|IBM}} in this case) to compile your code, which would take from four to six weeks. If there was a simple error, you would have to ship it again for another compilation.

Nothing of what she tells Cueball makes any sense, but it is clear from Cueball's final ''Wow'' that he falls for it, ready to believe anything the old Hairbun tells him about how horrible it was to program in the olden days. It is true that it was tough and slow to program on punch cards, which were actually used for an extended period of time, but there is nothing in the rest of Hairbun's story that accurate, except that it was a big deal when the floppy disk was invented.

In the title text, Hairbun continues her musings on the old compiler days, stating that there was ''a lot of drama in those days''. Specifically the references ''[http://www.win.tue.nl/~aeb/linux/hh/thompson/trust.html Reflections on Trusting Trust]'' a famous 1984 paper by {{w|UNIX}} co-creator {{w|Ken Thompson}} in which he described a way to hide a virtually undetectable backdoor in the UNIX login code via a second backdoor in the C compiler. Using the technique in his paper, it would be impossible to discover the hacked login by examining the official source code for either the login or the compiler itself. Ken Thompson may have actually included this backdoor in early versions of UNIX, undiscovered. Ken Thompson's paper demonstrated that it was functionally impossible to prove that any piece of software was fully trustworthy.

Hairbun claims that one of the dramas she refers to was that people tried to force Ken Thompson to retire, so everyone could stop being so paranoid about compilers. In reality, any coder who created the first version of a compiler (or a similar critical component) could inject a similar backdoor into software, so it would be false safety. Even if no one else had thought of this, then Thompson's paper was there for any future hacker to see. Though the problem was (claimed to be) solved in {{w|David A. Wheeler}} Ph.D dissertation "[http://www.dwheeler.com/trusting-trust/ Fully Countering Trusting Trust through Diverse Double-Compiling (DDC)]".

==Table of statements==
{|class="wikitable"
!Statements
!Concepts used
!Explanation
|-
|Compile things for different processors
|Compilers convert code from a human-readable programming language into a binary code that can be directly executed by computer processors.
|Many popular modern programming languages are either interpreted - meaning that they run directly from source code - or compile to an intermediate bytecode, like Java or common Python implementations. Programs written in such languages are portable across processor architectures - x86 to ARM, for example. Lower-level languages must take into account the features available on a given processor architecture and operating system. Before that, programs needed to compile directly into the native machine language for each processor they were intended to run on.
Native machine language is dependent on processor architecture. Therefore different processors designed around different architectures will not run the same compiled code (unless the architectures are compatible; AMD64 processors will run i386 code natively, for example.) If the same code needs to be run on multiple architectures, it must be compiled separately for each supported architecture.
|-
|To compile your code, you had to mail it to IBM. It took 4-6 weeks.
|Similar to sending Kodachrome slide film to Kodak to be developed.
|While IBM has released multiple compilers, they sent the compiler to you, you did not send the code to them. There is some kind of truth in the statement, though: When programming on mainframes, programmers submitted their source code in the evening for compilation over night. When there was an error in the code, they did not get a compiled version of it back, and had to resubmit their code. Sometimes there were time slots available for compilation, and in universities, students will have to wait for their next time slot for another try.
|-
|Before garbage collection, data would pile up until the computer got full and you had to throw it away.
|A {{w|Garbage collection (computer science)|garbage collector}} is a piece of the software that cleans the {{w|RAM}} of data that is no longer being used in the execution of a program.
|Hairbun's comment is grounded in reality. Garbage collection is a form of memory management that generally destroys objects or frees up memory once a program no longer needs it. In languages without automatic memory management, like C, the program itself must keep track of what memory has been allocated, and free it once it is no longer needed. If the program does not, it can end up trying to use more memory than the computer has, and may crash. This was, however, a ''temporary'' condition. In the worst case, a simple reboot will clear the computer's memory.
|-
|Early compilers could handle code fine, but comments had to be written in assembly.
|A {{w|Comment (computer programming)|comment}} in programming is a text written in natural language that is meant to explain some feature of the source code; it is tagged such that the compiler will discard it to save space. {{w|Assembly}} is a low-level programming language.
|Comments, in code, are portions of one or more lines that are ignored by the compiler. They are commonly used to explain or comment on the code itself. But sometimes the comments are written in a certain way to compile documentation automatically from it. Also, when examining the output of compilers it's a common practice to use assembly code annotated with comments containing the source code of the program from which the assembly code was generated.

Hairbun's comment is thus very strange, implying the compilers of the day could only distinguish between comments and code if assembly was used to insert the separating tags.
|-
|C could only be written on punch cards. You had to pick a compact font, or you'd only fit a few characters per card.
|{{w|C (programming language)|C}} is a programming language. A {{w|punch card}} is a primitive form of storing data; it stored data in {{w|binary language}} with holes in a paper or cardboard card where a hole meant a 1 and the absence of a hole meant a 0.
|While punch cards were used through the late 1970s and early 1980s to enter programs and data in COBOL, FORTRAN and other early languages, the use of punch cards and punch card machines had been replaced by a {{w|text editor}} long before C (or C++) was developed as a language. This site demonstrates a card punch and cards http://www.masswerk.at/keypunch/

Hairbun claims that code was not written using keyboards, but by punching out letter and character shapes in the punch cards, and the computer would load read keystrokes that way. Simply put, this was never true. Punch cards store characters in binary; there is no font involved and they store up to fixed limit of characters per card (80 characters in the most common format.)
|-
|C++ was big because it supported floppy disks. It still punched holes in them, but it was a start.
|{{w|C++ (programming language)|C++}} is a programming language. A {{w|floppy disk}} is a form of storing data magnetically. It's more advanced than punch cards, but it's still old.
|Hairbun says that the improvement from C to C++ was that C++ finally "supported floppy disks", but then it turns out that in C++ the floppy disks were just used instead of punch cards. So the programing was to make holes in floppy disks rather than punch cards. This would of course not be an improvement as floppy disks store information magnetically, as opposed to physically, as punch cards do. This is likely a play on the concept of punching holes in 5.25" floppy disks to double their storage (Source: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Double-sided_disk&oldid=713168494).
|}

==Transcript==
:[Cueball and Hairbun are standing together and Cueball is talking to her.]
:Cueball: What were things like in the old days?
:Cueball: I hear that you had to ... compile things for different processors?
:Hairbun: Yeah

:[Same setting in a slimmer panel, now Hairbun is replying.]
:Hairbun: To compile your code, you had to mail it to IBM.
:Hairbun: It took 4-6 weeks.

:[Close-up of Hairbun from the waist up.]
:Hairbun: Before garbage collection, data would pile up until the computer got full and you had to throw it away.

:[Same setting as in the first panel with Hairbun gesturing toward Cueball raising one hand palm up.]
:Hairbun: Early compilers could handle code fine, but comments had to be written in assembly.

:[In a frame-less panel Hairbun is seen from the front, with both arms out to the side with both hands held palm up.]
:Hairbun: '''C''' could only be written on punch cards.You had to pick a compact font, or you'd only fit a few characters per card.

:[Exactly the same setting as the first panel, but with Hairbun doing the talking.]
:Hairbun: '''C++''' was big because it supported floppy disks.
:Hairbun: It still punched holes in them, but it was a start.
:Cueball: Wow.

{{comic discussion}}

[[Category:Comics featuring Cueball]]
[[Category:Comics featuring Hairbun]]
[[Category:Programming]]

1326: Sharks

2016-01-05T19:35:47Z

Marklark: /* Explanation */

{{comic
| number = 1326
| date = February 5, 2014
| title = Sharks
| image = sharks.png
| titletext = 'Now, minions, I'm off to inspect our shark cages.' 'Do you really need to inspect them this often?' 'PRISONERS MUST NEVER ESCAPE.'
}}

==Explanation==
This comic is a joke about the use of sharks in action movies. In these movies, sharks are often used to guard locations and dispense capital punishment.[http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SharkPool] Since the idea of a guard shark is not practical, this comic suggests that villains raise sharks to help with declining shark populations in the oceans.

In this comic [[Cueball]] is an evil villain who rules over a "Doom Island." In addition to commanding minions and detaining prisoners, he keeps sharks to threaten prisoners. When a prisoner escapes the island, he orders his minions to "release the sharks." However, the sharks do not hunt the prisoner, but merely swim away. The comic jokes that Cueball is using fugitives as a pretense to help with declining shark populations, and that Doom Island is just a front for a marine biology center. Cueball maintains the whole "guard sharks" idea as a cover-up, so that his minions do not catch on to the real mission.

The title text plays on the idea that Cueball can't be openly concerned with his sharks' welfare without his minions catching on. He claims to be inspecting the shark cages. As a {{w|shark proof cage|shark cage}} is normally used to provide protection for divers wishing to observe sharks up-close, they would not work well as cages to hold prisoners (which is their stated purpose). The comic implies that when he is "inspecting the cages" he is really performing a scientific study on the sharks, or simply observing them because he loves them.

Because a real villainous lair would have no use for shark cages, it follows that Cueball owns them solely for the purpose of gratifying his interest in his sharks, thus forcing him to keep up the pretense of the cages being of some help in preventing prisoners from escaping.

The shark issue is also one of the items on the chart of [[1331: Frequency]].

===Use of sharks in movies===
In action movie trope from the '70s and '80s, evil villains use sharks to kill off enemies. Some examples are:
*{{w|Le Magnifique}}, with the opening scene of the French movie a spy is trapped in a phone booth, which is then lifted by an helicopter and lowered into the sea, where a squad of frogmen attach it to a shark's cage before opening the door.
*{{w|The Phantom (1996 film)|The Phantom}}, the Sengh Brotherhood has a [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SharkPool Shark Pool] in their [http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/ElaborateUndergroundBase Elaborate Underground Base]. This is one of the parts of the film lifted directly from the very first Phantom story, published in 1936, so the trope is at least that old.
*{{w|Despicable Me}}, where the comical villain has a shark in his lair that unrealistically acts as a guard dog.
*{{w|Austin Powers: International Man of Mystery}}, Dr. Evil wanted a pool full of sharks (with laser beams attached to their heads), but had to settle for ill-tempered mutated seabass.
And in the James Bond series:
*{{w|Thunderball (film)|Thunderball}}
*{{w|Live and Let Die (film)|Live and Let Die}}
*{{w|The Spy Who Loved Me (film)|The Spy Who Loved Me}}
*{{w|Never Say Never Again}} with electronically controlled sharks in the Caribbean.
*{{w|Licence to Kill}}

==Transcript==
:[Cueball is sitting on a throne, talking to a minion who's not shown in the panel.]
:Minion: The prisoner escaped and is swimming toward the mainland!
:Cueball: ''Release the sharks.''
:Minion: Yes, sir.

:Minion: The sharks are swimming away.
:Cueball: They're escaping, too? Send sharks after them!

:Minion: Now ''those'' sharks are swimming away.
:Cueball: '''''More sharks.'''''
:Minion: ...Sir, what's going on?
:Cueball: Prisoners, of course! Can't let 'em escape!

:Minion: Sir, are you trying to turn Doom Island into a marine biology center?
:Cueball: ''Shark populations are in decline–''
:Cueball: *ahem*
:Cueball: I mean, the world must fear us!
:Minion: Right...

{{comic discussion}}
[[Category:Comics featuring Cueball]]
[[Category:Sharks]]

1189: Voyager 1

2015-12-31T16:23:05Z

Marklark: /* Explanation */ un-did my previous edit upon realizing that heliosphere would then be used (only just!) before defined

{{comic
| number = 1189
| date = March 22, 2013
| title = Voyager 1
| image = voyager_1.png
| titletext = So far Voyager 1 has 'left the Solar System' by passing through the termination shock three times, the heliopause twice, and once each through the heliosheath, heliosphere, heliodrome, auroral discontinuity, Heaviside layer, trans-Neptunian panic zone, magnetogap, US Census Bureau Solar System statistical boundary, Kuiper gauntlet, Oort void, and crystal sphere holding the fixed stars.
}}

==Explanation==
''{{w|Voyager 1}}'' is a U.S. space probe launched in 1977 to study the outer reaches of the Solar System and beyond. Popular press has on several occasions announced that it "has left the solar system" at each point when a boundary has been confirmed or a major event has taken place. This underscores the fact that there is no strictly defined and recognizable boundary of the solar system, or at least we haven't found one yet.

The title text lists several such possible boundaries, together with fictive humorous ones:

*The {{w|termination shock}} – the point in the heliosphere where the solar wind slows down to subsonic speed (relative to the star) because of interactions with the local interstellar medium.
*The {{w|Heliopause (astronomy)}} – the theoretical boundary where the Sun's solar wind is stopped by the interstellar medium.
*The {{w|heliosphere}} – a region of space dominated by Earth's Sun, a sort of bubble of charged particles in the space surrounding the Solar System.
*The {{w|heliosheath}} – the region of the heliosphere beyond the termination shock.
*Heliodrome – yet another composition of ''helios'' "sun," here together with ''dromos'' "course". There is no astronomical object with this name, but it has been used variously in other contexts. One that became famous is a sports hall which was used as a concentration camp in the Bosnian war, see {{w|Heliodrom camp}}.
*Auroral discontinuity - another fictitious astronomic object, for ''auroral'' see {{w|Aurora (astronomy)}}.
*{{w|Heaviside layer}} – a layer of ionized gas occurring between roughly 90–150 km (56–93 mi) above the ground in the Earth's atmosphere. Popularly recognized for its use as a reference to Heaven in the writings of {{w|T. S. Eliot}} adapted into {{w|Andrew Lloyd Webber}}'s musical ''{{w|Cats (musical)|Cats}}''.
*Trans-Neptunian panic zone – this fictional zone combines the word from two subjects: "Trans–Neptunian" is used in astronomy to describe stuff that occurs beyond the planet Neptune. In {{w|Outdoor education}} the "panic zone" is the opposite of the {{w|comfort zone}} when trying to learn new stuff.
*{{w|Ignition magneto|Magnetogap}} – part of an {{w|ignition system}}.
*US Census Bureau Solar System statistical boundary – a fictive boundary supposedly defined by the {{w|United States Census Bureau}}, similarly to how it defines {{w|Census tract|census areas}} for the purpose of processing statistical data about regions in the United States.
*Kuiper gauntlet – this is a play on the {{w|Kuiper belt}}, which is a region of the Solar System beyond the planets, extending from the orbit of Neptune (at 30 AU) to approximately 50 AU from the Sun, notable for being full of asteroids; replacing the word "belt" with "{{w|gauntlet (glove)}}" (often spelled 'gantlet') which is a protective glove as well as "{{w|gauntlet (punishment)}}" which is a medieval punishment where one would be forced to run through two lines of men who would hit the punishee.
*Oort void – refers to the {{w|Oort cloud}}, a gigantic "cloud" of materials (mainly composed of ice) which ends around a light-year from The Sun and is deemed the (current) "edge" of the solar system. The "void" may be pun on density of that "cloud" - the number of bodies in it may be huge, but given its size, it's mostly empty.
*Crystal sphere holding the fixed stars – this refers to historical ideas about the universe, particularly the {{w|Ptolemaic system}}, in which the stars were supposed to be fixed on a {{w|Celestial spheres|large crystal sphere}} around the Earth. It might also be referencing "{{w|The Crystal Spheres}}", a short story by David Brin, in which humanity's first interstellar ship shatters a previously undetected, protective barrier around the solar system. It may also be a reference to the Dungeons and Dragons setting "{{w|Spelljammer}}".

See also [http://arstechnica.com/science/2013/03/voyager-probes-key-transition-remains-mysterious/ Voyager over the “heliocliff,” but Solar System transition mysterious] article on Ars Technica.

==Transcript==
:Number of times ''Voyager 1'' has left the Solar System
:[22 tally marks.]

{{comic discussion}}
[[Category:Physics]]
[[Category:Charts]]
[[Category:Space]]

1189: Voyager 1

2015-12-31T16:20:39Z

Marklark: /* Explanation */ moved heliosheath into the order used in the comic mouse-over text

{{comic
| number = 1189
| date = March 22, 2013
| title = Voyager 1
| image = voyager_1.png
| titletext = So far Voyager 1 has 'left the Solar System' by passing through the termination shock three times, the heliopause twice, and once each through the heliosheath, heliosphere, heliodrome, auroral discontinuity, Heaviside layer, trans-Neptunian panic zone, magnetogap, US Census Bureau Solar System statistical boundary, Kuiper gauntlet, Oort void, and crystal sphere holding the fixed stars.
}}

==Explanation==
''{{w|Voyager 1}}'' is a U.S. space probe launched in 1977 to study the outer reaches of the Solar System and beyond. Popular press has on several occasions announced that it "has left the solar system" at each point when a boundary has been confirmed or a major event has taken place. This underscores the fact that there is no strictly defined and recognizable boundary of the solar system, or at least we haven't found one yet.

The title text lists several such possible boundaries, together with fictive humorous ones:

*The {{w|termination shock}} – the point in the heliosphere where the solar wind slows down to subsonic speed (relative to the star) because of interactions with the local interstellar medium.
*The {{w|Heliopause (astronomy)}} – the theoretical boundary where the Sun's solar wind is stopped by the interstellar medium.
*The {{w|heliosheath}} – the region of the heliosphere beyond the termination shock.
*The {{w|heliosphere}} – a region of space dominated by Earth's Sun, a sort of bubble of charged particles in the space surrounding the Solar System.
*Heliodrome – yet another composition of ''helios'' "sun," here together with ''dromos'' "course". There is no astronomical object with this name, but it has been used variously in other contexts. One that became famous is a sports hall which was used as a concentration camp in the Bosnian war, see {{w|Heliodrom camp}}.
*Auroral discontinuity - another fictitious astronomic object, for ''auroral'' see {{w|Aurora (astronomy)}}.
*{{w|Heaviside layer}} – a layer of ionized gas occurring between roughly 90–150 km (56–93 mi) above the ground in the Earth's atmosphere. Popularly recognized for its use as a reference to Heaven in the writings of {{w|T. S. Eliot}} adapted into {{w|Andrew Lloyd Webber}}'s musical ''{{w|Cats (musical)|Cats}}''.
*Trans-Neptunian panic zone – this fictional zone combines the word from two subjects: "Trans–Neptunian" is used in astronomy to describe stuff that occurs beyond the planet Neptune. In {{w|Outdoor education}} the "panic zone" is the opposite of the {{w|comfort zone}} when trying to learn new stuff.
*{{w|Ignition magneto|Magnetogap}} – part of an {{w|ignition system}}.
*US Census Bureau Solar System statistical boundary – a fictive boundary supposedly defined by the {{w|United States Census Bureau}}, similarly to how it defines {{w|Census tract|census areas}} for the purpose of processing statistical data about regions in the United States.
*Kuiper gauntlet – this is a play on the {{w|Kuiper belt}}, which is a region of the Solar System beyond the planets, extending from the orbit of Neptune (at 30 AU) to approximately 50 AU from the Sun, notable for being full of asteroids; replacing the word "belt" with "{{w|gauntlet (glove)}}" (often spelled 'gantlet') which is a protective glove as well as "{{w|gauntlet (punishment)}}" which is a medieval punishment where one would be forced to run through two lines of men who would hit the punishee.
*Oort void – refers to the {{w|Oort cloud}}, a gigantic "cloud" of materials (mainly composed of ice) which ends around a light-year from The Sun and is deemed the (current) "edge" of the solar system. The "void" may be pun on density of that "cloud" - the number of bodies in it may be huge, but given its size, it's mostly empty.
*Crystal sphere holding the fixed stars – this refers to historical ideas about the universe, particularly the {{w|Ptolemaic system}}, in which the stars were supposed to be fixed on a {{w|Celestial spheres|large crystal sphere}} around the Earth. It might also be referencing "{{w|The Crystal Spheres}}", a short story by David Brin, in which humanity's first interstellar ship shatters a previously undetected, protective barrier around the solar system. It may also be a reference to the Dungeons and Dragons setting "{{w|Spelljammer}}".

See also [http://arstechnica.com/science/2013/03/voyager-probes-key-transition-remains-mysterious/ Voyager over the “heliocliff,” but Solar System transition mysterious] article on Ars Technica.

==Transcript==
:Number of times ''Voyager 1'' has left the Solar System
:[22 tally marks.]

{{comic discussion}}
[[Category:Physics]]
[[Category:Charts]]
[[Category:Space]]

Talk:1103: Nine

2015-12-29T23:03:38Z

Marklark:

I really find that the hover-over text applies to me more often than not, unless I'm not in mixed company. This reminds me of a time that I was staying with a friend and she walked in on me changing the time on her microwave. When I explained to her that her microwave, stove, and coffee pot were all set to different times and it was bugging me, she just looked at me like I was crazy. --[[User:Grate314|"grate314"]] ([[User talk:Grate314|talk]]) 16:47, 3 September 2012 (UTC)
:I don't think that is what the title text meant. Also, anybody who reads an xkcd comic and remembers that they did that ''is'' crazy. --[[Special:Contributions/98.221.139.80|98.221.139.80]]
:I agree with grate314. I have to fix this every time the power goes out in my house because the stove, microwave, and radio all treat power outages differently. Between different rooms, though, it doesn't bother me. --[[User:DanB|DanB]] ([[User talk:DanB|talk]]) 19:04, 3 September 2012 (UTC)
::I know that that isn't specifically what the hover-over text was talking about, but I was thinking of it in a more general way. I've just found that whenever someone asks me what I'm thinking about, it's best to say 'nothing'. What I meant by 'mixed company' is a general social gathering, like a wedding or birthday party. I'm an EE student, so when someone asks me that question at school, I answer honestly. The answer is usually 'soldering'. I think about soldering a lot. Thanks, DanB, the clocks were all on top of each other, btw, I'm not sure how she lived in that chaos.--[[User:Grate314|grate314]] ([[User talk:Grate314|talk]]) 21:27, 3 September 2012 (UTC)

Did anybody try doing what the title text is saying? Just wondering. --[[Special:Contributions/98.221.139.80|98.221.139.80]]

When I'm not following written instructions, I tend to use multiples of 1:11, out of laziness. So, if I figure something should take about 2-3 minutes, I'll nuke it for 2:22. That way, I can press one button 3 times without having to move my finger. [[User:MGK|MGK]] ([[User talk:MGK|talk]]) 17:23, 3 September 2012 (UTC)

If your microwave is connected to your home network you should accept that GCHQ have probably broken all your codes.[[User:Weatherlawyer| I used Google News BEFORE it was clickbait]] ([[User talk:Weatherlawyer|talk]]) 20:03, 20 January 2015 (UTC)

I'm lazy and like to use repeated digits rather than have to move my finger along to find the next one - thus 33, 55, 66 get used a lot. I also find that for most items, longer time at lower power settings is more effective at even heating, so I do a lot of 66 at 50% rather than 33 at 100%. Our current oven only has 10 power settings, unlike a previous one that had two digit power settings resulting in 66 sec at 55% being a fairly commonly used setup. Interestingly, the logic of every microwave oven I have encountered treats 99 entered in the seconds display the same as if one were to have entered 1minute and 33 seconds. Thus 99:99 would be 100 minutes and 33 seconds. [[User:J-beda|J-beda]] ([[User talk:J-beda|talk]]) 17:31, 3 September 2012 (UTC)

Oddly (apparently) my microwave has only 3 buttons (10 minutes, 1 minute, 10 seconds), though I do feel sorry for the 10 minute button.
:Maybe it would make more sense to change the 10 minutes button to a 6 minutes button [[Special:Contributions/212.23.140.110|212.23.140.110]] 16:39, 5 September 2012 (UTC)

I usually just push the "add 30 seconds" button until I reach the desired time (6 pushes for three minutes, 3 for 1:30, etc.). [[User:Erenan|Erenan]] ([[User talk:Erenan|talk]]) 16:06, 4 September 2012 (UTC)

:mine only has a single analogue dial that jumps up in increasingly large steps, and for some reason is numbered to skip over some sensible times, such as six minutes. however, no buttons, so problem solved. [[Special:Contributions/86.15.83.223|86.15.83.223]] 22:00, 29 December 2012 (UTC)

The 9 and 0 button are near each other so I do a lot of 90 (meaning 1 minute, 30 seconds). Sometimes, I'll get lazy<strike>er</strike> and press 99.

'''Quasar '''unit offers the additional accuracy/simplicity/utility of min 10, 1 and sec 10, 1 There are no other numbers on the control face, which has 14 buttons total. hmm, Minimum number of buttons required to accomplish nuking?--[[User:Idkrash|Idkrash]] ([[User talk:Idkrash|talk]]) 01:28, 5 September 2012 (UTC)
:For simplicity I would be in favor of 2 dials and 2 buttons. The dials could serve for power and time, which could output to digital displays. The buttons then could serve as start and stop. Pressing start and stop simultaneously would toggle the clock set function and you could use the dials to set the min and hour.----[[User:Shine|Shine]] ([[User talk:Shine|talk]]) 10:47, 5 September 2012 (UTC)
::I suspect that sooner or later they'll all just have a power button and a touchscreen. [[User:Erenan|Erenan]] ([[User talk:Erenan|talk]]) 15:15, 5 September 2012 (UTC)
::Agreed that the touchscreen is likely but you could get away with just the two dials by having the time dial start the oven when it is pulled out and stop when pushed in. (#Analog) --[[User:DanB|DanB]] ([[User talk:DanB|talk]]) 19:18, 5 September 2012 (UTC)
::: My microwave already has a touch screen... we use the 30 second button on it a lot... --[[User:Tustin2121|Tustin2121]] ([[User talk:Tustin2121|talk]]) 16:36, 9 September 2012 (UTC)

[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Benford's_law Benfords law] pops to mind.

I don't use 20, 30 ,40, because find it easier to just click twice same button: 11, 22, 33, 44, 55, 66, 77, 88, 99 and anything beyond 99 seconds - well, 200 {{unsigned ip|82.71.241.138|17:25, 6 December 2012‎ (UTC)}}

As a datum-point, my microwave has a (linear, clockwork, with mechanical bell-ding) dial, which is imprecise enough. Also it's a ''really'' old one (20 years old? 25? 30?) with a lower power than is common to see mentioned, so I look at the packaging recommendations, see perhaps 650W, 750W and 850W times, or 700W and 800W ones, and then add half again onto the lower rate's required time, and then perhaps a little more for good luck, as the amount I (roughly) twist the dial. I rarely use anything other than 'full'-power, out of the five settings. And I still sometimes need to renuke after testing. I really ought to get a new one. Probably would be more efficient, as well as accurate. ;) [[Special:Contributions/178.98.141.216|178.98.141.216]] 13:07, 31 March 2013 (UTC)

Shockingly, no one has mentioned Cirno from Touhou Project.--[[Special:Contributions/67.78.126.46|67.78.126.46]] 12:41, 14 October 2013 (UTC)

Shockingly, noone has mentioned that 159 seconds is closer to 3 minutes that it is to 2. [[User:Marklark|Marklark]] ([[User talk:Marklark|talk]]) 23:03, 29 December 2015 (UTC)