2948: Electric vs Gas - Revision history

82.132.239.130: Undo revision 409038 by 2001:4450:81E7:1E00:ADD6:A33:300F:1CBB (talk)

2026-03-30T03:46:52Z

Undo revision 409038 by 2001:4450:81E7:1E00:ADD6:A33:300F:1CBB (talk)

2001:4450:81E7:1E00:ADD6:A33:300F:1CBB at 00:48, 30 March 2026

2026-03-30T00:48:11Z

Boilersuit: /* Explanation */ Changed 'impractical' to 'impracticable'

2025-11-07T14:51:10Z

‎Explanation: Changed 'impractical' to 'impracticable'

123456: Grammar

2025-08-14T02:30:36Z

Grammar

172.68.27.77 at 20:51, 27 December 2024

2024-12-27T20:51:22Z

162.158.174.48 at 20:42, 27 December 2024

2024-12-27T20:42:34Z

162.158.186.178: /* Explanation */ Mentioned other similar areas

2024-08-31T23:53:26Z

‎Explanation: Mentioned other similar areas

PotatoGod: Correct typo and add one more detail

2024-08-01T10:44:51Z

Correct typo and add one more detail

PotatoGod: More corrections to misinformation

2024-08-01T10:40:29Z

More corrections to misinformation

141.101.105.132 at 08:20, 29 July 2024

2024-07-29T08:20:02Z

@@ Line 8: / Line 8: @@
 | titletext = An idling gas engine may be annoyingly loud, but that's the price you pay for having WAY less torque available at a standstill.
 }}
-{{TOC}}
 ==Explanation==
 {{w|Internal combustion engine|Internal combustion engines}} (ICEs) have long been the most common technology used to propel motor vehicles (usually in the specific form of reciprocating "piston" engines). In US vernacular, the most common vehicle fuel is known as "{{w|gasoline}}", or "gas" for short, leading to these engines being referred to as "gas engines". Gasoline is a product of petroleum refinement, leading to the name "petrol" being used in other dialects.

@@ Line 8: / Line 8: @@
 | titletext = An idling gas engine may be annoyingly loud, but that's the price you pay for having WAY less torque available at a standstill.
 }}
+{{TOC}}
 ==Explanation==
 {{w|Internal combustion engine|Internal combustion engines}} (ICEs) have long been the most common technology used to propel motor vehicles (usually in the specific form of reciprocating "piston" engines). In US vernacular, the most common vehicle fuel is known as "{{w|gasoline}}", or "gas" for short, leading to these engines being referred to as "gas engines". Gasoline is a product of petroleum refinement, leading to the name "petrol" being used in other dialects.

@@ Line 12: / Line 12: @@
 {{w|Internal combustion engine|Internal combustion engines}} (ICEs) have long been the most common technology used to propel motor vehicles (usually in the specific form of reciprocating "piston" engines). In US vernacular, the most common vehicle fuel is known as "{{w|gasoline}}", or "gas" for short, leading to these engines being referred to as "gas engines". Gasoline is a product of petroleum refinement, leading to the name "petrol" being used in other dialects.
-{{w|Traction motor|Electric motors}} would seem the more well-suited method for propelling a vehicle, and as early as 1885 were an actual form of motor car engine with which the fledgling internal combustion engine had to compete. Despite this early popularity, over most of the 20th century electric motors were sidelined in everyday car design, as supplying the electricity was considered to be impractical for most forms of transportation. Modern forms are rapidly rising in popularity, and [https://www.iea.org/reports/global-ev-outlook-2024/trends-in-electric-cars now constitute 18% of all global vehicle sales]. [[Randall]] is a strong proponent of {{w|electric vehicle}}s (EVs).
+{{w|Traction motor|Electric motors}} would seem the more well-suited method for propelling a vehicle, and as early as 1885 were an actual form of motor car engine with which the fledgling internal combustion engine had to compete. Despite this early popularity, over most of the 20th century electric motors were sidelined in everyday car design, as supplying the electricity was considered to be impracticable for most forms of transportation. Modern forms are rapidly rising in popularity, and [https://www.iea.org/reports/global-ev-outlook-2024/trends-in-electric-cars now constitute 18% of all global vehicle sales]. [[Randall]] is a strong proponent of {{w|electric vehicle}}s (EVs).
 In this strip, [[White Hat]] claims to be comparing the pros and cons of electric motors and gas engines. The joke is that every point he makes goes in favor of electric motors. Despite it being posed as a dilemma, it may be very clear which side of the debate White Hat is promoting. On the other hand, it may indicate that one of the things we might consider a pro in electric motors (the instantaneous power now available, exceeding that of many non-electric engines) he would consider a problem — perhaps more accurately, a problem with the ''drivers'' of such vehicles — recklessly using the enhanced capabilities to accelerate to high speeds at all opportunities, whether safe to do so or not.

@@ Line 40: / Line 40: @@
 * Limited charging infrastructure compared to the prevalence of fuel stations
 ** Because many drivers can charge at home, fewer public chargers are needed than for gas cars.
-* Higher vehicle weight, and resulting higher particulate emissions (from tires, but not brakes, because EVs use of regenerative braking reduces wear on their traditional brakes)
+* Higher vehicle weight, and resulting higher particulate emissions (from tires, but not brakes, because EVs' use of regenerative braking reduces wear on their traditional brakes)
 * Reliance on some mineral and metal extraction industries (e.g., lithium) with capacity that lags the recent increased demands for EVs
 * Increased demand on electricity production

@@ Line 35: / Line 35: @@
 * Higher cost of purchase (primarily due to the cost of batteries and, in the USA, now a 100% tariff on Chinese EVs), although partially offset by lower costs of operation
 * Long charging times compared to refilling a gas tank (there are some approaches which mitigate this by operating either very high-powered chargers or a battery swap model, rather than charging in-car, but these are not widely adopted)
-**It's important to note, however, that for most human people that occasionally need food or to use the bathroom, the charging times are a non-issue, as most drivers will welcome a short 5-15 minute break after several hours of driving as their car charges.
+** The significance of this depends on individual situations. Most EV drivers charge primarily at night, and many drivers don't mind a charging break on long trips.
-* Relatively limited range ([https://ev-database.org/compare/electric-vehicle-longest-range 200-500 miles per charge] as of 2024, though this limitation applies to most gas vehicles as well, where 300 mile range is typical)
+* Relatively limited range. This is less of an issue in modern times, as many modern EVs have ranges of ([https://ev-database.org/compare/electric-vehicle-longest-range 200-500 miles per charge] as of 2024, similar to the range of a typical ICE vehicle.
 * Shortened range in hot weather and significantly shortened range in cold weather (while all vehicles have this problem, it's more pronounced in EVs compared to ICEs)
 * Limited charging infrastructure compared to the prevalence of fuel stations
@@ Line 46: / Line 46: @@
 Other real pros of electric cars are also not mentioned:
-* Lower total cost of ownership (TCO)[https://www.edf.org/sites/default/files/2023-0/WSP%20Total%20Cost%20of%20Ownership%20Analysis%20July%202023.pdf]
+* Lower total cost of ownership (TCO), due to cheaper fuel and lower maintenance costs. [https://www.edf.org/sites/default/files/2023-0/WSP%20Total%20Cost%20of%20Ownership%20Analysis%20July%202023.pdf]
-* Can "fill" them at home or while parked without having to stay with them (partially negates the "long charging times" con)
+* Can potentially "fill" them at home or while parked without having to stay with them (partially negates the issue of "long charging times".)
 * Lower carbon footprint, and reduced dependence on the fossil fuel industry
@@ Line 57: / Line 57: @@
 Especially in the United States, this topic is highly contentious for political, economic, engineering, and {{w|Rolling coal|tribal}} reasons (as a quick look at the edit history of this page will confirm).
 ==Trivia==

@@ Line 19: / Line 19: @@
 * "Cleaner and more efficient". ICEs produce and vent harmful combustion products and toxic chemicals, while electric motors produce no emission byproducts at the point of use. The efficiency of both gas and electric motors vary, but the typical ICE vehicle in the US converts around 25% of available energy into motion, while the typical electric vehicle is in the neighborhood of 80%. Even when considering inefficiencies in the source production and transmission and storage and release of energy, battery-driven electric vehicles are generally more efficient than internal combustion propelled vehicles[https://www.factcheck.org/2024/02/electric-vehicles-contribute-fewer-emissions-than-gasoline-powered-cars-over-their-lifetimes/].
-** It should be noted that all of this refers to the motors only, and ignores how the fuel and electricity are produced, or the wider environmental impact of the vehicle. Electric vehicles are also more environmentally friendly in this aspect, as many renewable power sources are available (including solar, wind, hydro, nuclear, etc), and that grid-scale power production even with fossil fuels is much more efficient than individual small engines in every vehicle.
+** It should be noted that all of this refers to the motors only, and ignores how the fuel and electricity are produced, or the wider environmental impact of the vehicle. Determining the overall environmental advantages of electric vehicles is a much more complex and involved calculation.
 * "More powerful". Electric motors are able to deliver a lot of power from a small motor ''if'' an ample energy supply is available, and can do so 'on demand', often far quicker than a fuel-powered engine that has to put its power through a gearbox in order to service a wide range of road velocities, from standstill to the eventual top speed. Due to battery limitations, short or partial runtime use cases (such as dragsters, hand tools, yard tools, toys and electric scooters) net the most benefit from the small size of a high-powered electric motor.
@@ Line 28: / Line 28: @@
 * "WAY less {{w|torque}} available at standstill". ICEs need to continually operate within a specific range of rotational speeds for best power and fuel efficiency (although the reciprocating engines used in most motor vehicles are still better than some others, such as {{w|gas turbine}} engines, in this regard), which means that a complex system of {{w|transmission|transmission gearing}} is needed to convert this motion into the specific speeds needed at the wheels. When starting from a standstill, this means that torque must be applied to the wheels relatively gradually to avoid stalling the engine. In addition, when a vehicle is standing still, the motor is typically idling at (very) low speed and must be sped up before it produces significant acceleration. Electric motors, in contrast, generally produce their peak torque when at a standstill. This results in electric vehicles having significantly better acceleration and engine responsiveness. Again, this could cause a legitimate problem with drivers changing from ICE to electric motors, because the new cars accelerate more than the driver is used to and provide different feedback. The audible clues of gear changes, whether from automatic or manual systems, are part and parcel of what many people have grown up with and come to rely on in anticipating what might need paying attention to.
-It should be noted that White Hat is deliberately confining his arguments to electric vs gas ''motors'' rather than electric or gas-powered ''vehicles''. Doing so ignores the basic reason why internal combustion vehicles have long dominated transportation in certain specific countries: hydrocarbon fuels are a very dense and fairly easy to handle form of energy ''storage''. Providing electrical power to a moving vehicle requires either that the vehicle remain in contact with a power line (as with an electric train or a tram) or else to carry a high-capacity battery (and the ability to recharge that battery in a reasonable amount of time, while stationary). More popular in the USA is a hybrid system, where a combustion engine provides at least some of the power to an electric motor, which was impractical until comparatively recently. Other methods, such as hydrogen fuel cells (a form of "combustion" that can be used more directly to form electricity), have been proposed, but remain experimental or niche, due to various barriers to adoption.
+It should be noted that White Hat is deliberately confining his arguments to electric vs gas ''motors'' rather than electric or gas-powered ''vehicles''. Doing so ignores the basic reason why internal combustion vehicles have long been the dominant form of personal, motorized transportation: hydrocarbon fuels are a very dense and fairly easy to handle form of energy ''storage''. Providing electrical power to a moving vehicle requires either that the vehicle remain in contact with a power line (as with an electric train or a tram) or else to carry a high-capacity battery (and the ability to recharge that battery in a reasonable amount of time, while stationary). More popular in the USA is a hybrid system, where a combustion engine provides at least some of the power to an electric motor, which was impractical until comparatively recently. Other methods, such as hydrogen fuel cells (a form of "combustion" that can be used more directly to form electricity), have been proposed, but remain experimental or niche, due to various barriers to adoption.
 A more comprehensive comparison would include many more factors, both against and in favor of electric cars.

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:53, 31 August 2024
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	Especially in the United States, this topic is highly contentious for political, economic, engineering, and {{w\|Rolling coal\|tribal}} reasons (as a quick look at the edit history of this page will confirm).		Especially in the United States, this topic is highly contentious for political, economic, engineering, and {{w\|Rolling coal\|tribal}} reasons (as a quick look at the edit history of this page will confirm).
		+
		+	There are other areas where a similar pretend tradeoff could be implied when the electric option actually has all of the advantages. For example, electric stoves are faster and more efficient than natural gas stoves, but this is the price to pay for the lack of noxious nitrogen oxides released during combustion.

	==Trivia==		==Trivia==

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:20, 29 July 2024
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	==Explanation==		==Explanation==
−	~~{{incomplete\|Created by a HYDROGEN INTERNAL COMBUSTION ENGINE RUNNING A GENERATOR. Do NOT delete this tag too soon.}}~~
−
	{{w\|Internal combustion engine\|Internal combustion engines}} (ICEs) have long been the most common technology used to propel motor vehicles (usually in the specific form of reciprocating "piston" engines). In US vernacular, the most common vehicle fuel is known as "{{w\|gasoline}}", or "gas" for short, leading to these engines being referred to as "gas engines". Gasoline is a product of petroleum refinement, leading to the name "petrol" being used in other dialects.		{{w\|Internal combustion engine\|Internal combustion engines}} (ICEs) have long been the most common technology used to propel motor vehicles (usually in the specific form of reciprocating "piston" engines). In US vernacular, the most common vehicle fuel is known as "{{w\|gasoline}}", or "gas" for short, leading to these engines being referred to as "gas engines". Gasoline is a product of petroleum refinement, leading to the name "petrol" being used in other dialects.