Talk:2004: Sun and Earth - Revision history

Nitpicking: Science nitpicking!

2022-07-15T11:50:38Z

Science nitpicking!

VannaWho at 06:55, 13 June 2018

2018-06-13T06:55:26Z

NiceGuy1 at 06:07, 12 June 2018

2018-06-12T06:07:52Z

Rtanenbaum at 13:39, 11 June 2018

2018-06-11T13:39:30Z

172.68.211.10 at 01:30, 11 June 2018

2018-06-11T01:30:29Z

Dgbrt at 18:11, 10 June 2018

2018-06-10T18:11:05Z

Dgbrt: Please sign your comments.

2018-06-10T17:45:05Z

Please sign your comments.

VannaWho at 06:31, 10 June 2018

2018-06-10T06:31:19Z

Herobrine: Wrong link

2018-06-10T03:13:37Z

Wrong link

Herobrine: Typo

2018-06-10T03:12:46Z

Typo

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 ) I thought that a different enjoyment of the jokes in this comic, should be mentioned. It looks very much, in the comic, like the Sun and the Earth are heating elements sandwiching humans and the Earth's atmosphere within. Global warming aside, this is funny because it feels like we are in an oven of sorts, though we actually are not being cooked. For food, for one non-reason. {{unsigned ip|162.158.165.226}}
 : Yes that was my thought, that the drawing is suggestive of a hamburger inside a toasted bun viewed from the side. [[User:Rtanenbaum|Rtanenbaum]] ([[User talk:Rtanenbaum|talk]]) 13:39, 11 June 2018 (UTC)
+:To say that particles "gain energy" is not incorrect. It is verbal shorthand for "gain kinetic energy". Everyone knows what you mean. The sun is not powered by gravitational collapse. As the article says, it's powered by nuclear fusion. The energy to ''trigger'' the fusion came from gravitational potential being converted to thermal, but the actual radiated energy comes from fusion. [[User:Nitpicking|Nitpicking]] ([[User talk:Nitpicking|talk]]) 11:50, 15 July 2022 (UTC)
 The second and third paragraphs as written are completely wrong.
 It take much more than a energy gradient to result in convection - both gravity and different density regions in the medium must be present - generally convective system are in media that become less dense at higher temperatures, and are heated in the region of lower gravitational potential. The media expands as it heats becoming less dense then rises against gravity as cooler higher density media flows to replace it.  Since the two flows can not occur simultaneously in the same location, generally the flow self organizes into cells or adjacent regions of counter flow.

@@ Line 7: / Line 7: @@
 ::::Thanks for your complaint. I can see it now and it also happens by using Google Chrome on a desktop when reducing the size of the browser window. Firefox doesn't look better. It's now on my ToDo list and I'm looking forward to implement a mobile version in the future. Stay tuned... --[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 18:11, 10 June 2018 (UTC)
 ::::Probably the only effective way to share a screenshot is to sign up for an image sharing site like Imgur, Flikr or Photobucket, put it there, then include a link to the image here. [[User:NiceGuy1|NiceGuy1]] ([[User talk:NiceGuy1|talk]]) 06:07, 12 June 2018 (UTC)
+::::It looks fine now. [[User:VannaWho|VannaWho]] ([[User talk:VannaWho|talk]]) 06:55, 13 June 2018 (UTC)
 The current explanation suggests that solar flares and volcanic eruptions are always quite benign. My interpretation of this comic, when I read it, was that volcanic eruptions can indeed be very deadly and potentially kill most humans (supervolcano, mini ice age... etc). But they are indeed rare enough that all humans currently alive and many generations to come are pretty safe from that risk.
 Not sure if a solar eruption could actually threaten humanity, beyond damaging our satellites. {{unsigned ip|141.101.88.88}}

@@ Line 6: / Line 6: @@
 ::: I'm on Google Chrome from my phone, and the bar has a little extra bit above it. It's hard to explain, is there a way to attach a screenshot? --[[User:VannaWho|VannaWho]] ([[User talk:VannaWho|talk]]) 06:31, 10 June 2018 (UTC)
 ::::Thanks for your complaint. I can see it now and it also happens by using Google Chrome on a desktop when reducing the size of the browser window. Firefox doesn't look better. It's now on my ToDo list and I'm looking forward to implement a mobile version in the future. Stay tuned... --[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 18:11, 10 June 2018 (UTC)
 The current explanation suggests that solar flares and volcanic eruptions are always quite benign. My interpretation of this comic, when I read it, was that volcanic eruptions can indeed be very deadly and potentially kill most humans (supervolcano, mini ice age... etc). But they are indeed rare enough that all humans currently alive and many generations to come are pretty safe from that risk.

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:39, 11 June 2018
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	3) I thought that a different enjoyment of the jokes in this comic, should be mentioned. It looks very much, in the comic, like the Sun and the Earth are heating elements sandwiching humans and the Earth's atmosphere within. Global warming aside, this is funny because it feels like we are in an oven of sorts, though we actually are not being cooked. For food, for one non-reason. {{unsigned ip\|162.158.165.226}}		3) I thought that a different enjoyment of the jokes in this comic, should be mentioned. It looks very much, in the comic, like the Sun and the Earth are heating elements sandwiching humans and the Earth's atmosphere within. Global warming aside, this is funny because it feels like we are in an oven of sorts, though we actually are not being cooked. For food, for one non-reason. {{unsigned ip\|162.158.165.226}}
		+	: Yes that was my thought, that the drawing is suggestive of a hamburger inside a toasted bun viewed from the side. [[User:Rtanenbaum\|Rtanenbaum]] ([[User talk:Rtanenbaum\|talk]]) 13:39, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

	The second and third paragraphs as written are completely wrong.		The second and third paragraphs as written are completely wrong.

← Older revision		Revision as of 01:30, 11 June 2018
Line 29:		Line 29:
	It take much more than a energy gradient to result in convection - both gravity and different density regions in the medium must be present - generally convective system are in media that become less dense at higher temperatures, and are heated in the region of lower gravitational potential. The media expands as it heats becoming less dense then rises against gravity as cooler higher density media flows to replace it. Since the two flows can not occur simultaneously in the same location, generally the flow self organizes into cells or adjacent regions of counter flow.		It take much more than a energy gradient to result in convection - both gravity and different density regions in the medium must be present - generally convective system are in media that become less dense at higher temperatures, and are heated in the region of lower gravitational potential. The media expands as it heats becoming less dense then rises against gravity as cooler higher density media flows to replace it. Since the two flows can not occur simultaneously in the same location, generally the flow self organizes into cells or adjacent regions of counter flow.
	Neither the sun which is a main sequence star in its stable Hydrogen burning phase nor the Earth are appreciably heated by gravitational collapse. For the sun gravity does provide the pressures needed for, and contains, the resulting fusion processes that do provide the energy released by the sun. The Earth core is heated by the decay of radioactive elements and the energy released is in very near equilibrium with the energy lost to the surface and ultimately radiated away along with the energy received from external sources (overwhelmingly from the sun). This has resulted in a stable internal temperature profile and surprisingly stable surface temperatures with in a very few degrees (<15C) for billions of years.[[Special:Contributions/162.158.126.76\|162.158.126.76]] 17:17, 9 June 2018 (UTC)		Neither the sun which is a main sequence star in its stable Hydrogen burning phase nor the Earth are appreciably heated by gravitational collapse. For the sun gravity does provide the pressures needed for, and contains, the resulting fusion processes that do provide the energy released by the sun. The Earth core is heated by the decay of radioactive elements and the energy released is in very near equilibrium with the energy lost to the surface and ultimately radiated away along with the energy received from external sources (overwhelmingly from the sun). This has resulted in a stable internal temperature profile and surprisingly stable surface temperatures with in a very few degrees (<15C) for billions of years.[[Special:Contributions/162.158.126.76\|162.158.126.76]] 17:17, 9 June 2018 (UTC)
		+
		+	*Someone ought to do a 'citation needed' joke about the Earth being hot --[[Special:Contributions/172.68.211.10\|172.68.211.10]] 01:30, 11 June 2018 (UTC)

@@ Line 18: / Line 18: @@
 And so Randall's solution is to [https://what-if.xkcd.com/49/ extinguish the sun]... thus creating a safer world free from the threat of solar flares! [[User:Herobrine|Herobrine]] ([[User talk:Herobrine|talk]]) 03:12, 10 June 2018 (UTC)
-== New Misc Points (3 of them) ==
+;New Misc Points (3 of them)
 ) We should not, as the current explanation does, say that the particles gain energy. The Law of Conservation of Energy strictly demands that we say, instead, that they convert gravitational potential energy into kinetic energy, but only as much as the resulting pressure, resisting gravitational collapse, allows.
 ) I know that the Sun, as a star, is powered by gravitational collapse. (Massy bodies, really? Why not "Huge, and therefore heavy, cloud of gas"?) I have never heard of the Earth's core being powered by gravitational collapse, obvious on hindsight as it may appear. It would also imply that Earth's radius is decreasing (measurable/measured?). Some citation to geophysical articles saying the same would be very much appreciated.
-) I thought that a different enjoyment of the jokes in this comic, should be mentioned. It looks very much, in the comic, like the Sun and the Earth are heating elements sandwiching humans and the Earth's atmosphere within. Global warming aside, this is funny because it feels like we are in an oven of sorts, though we actually are not being cooked. For food, for one non-reason.
+) I thought that a different enjoyment of the jokes in this comic, should be mentioned. It looks very much, in the comic, like the Sun and the Earth are heating elements sandwiching humans and the Earth's atmosphere within. Global warming aside, this is funny because it feels like we are in an oven of sorts, though we actually are not being cooked. For food, for one non-reason. {{unsigned ip|162.158.165.226}}
 The second and third paragraphs as written are completely wrong.
 It take much more than a energy gradient to result in convection - both gravity and different density regions in the medium must be present - generally convective system are in media that become less dense at higher temperatures, and are heated in the region of lower gravitational potential. The media expands as it heats becoming less dense then rises against gravity as cooler higher density media flows to replace it.  Since the two flows can not occur simultaneously in the same location, generally the flow self organizes into cells or adjacent regions of counter flow.
 Neither the sun which is a main sequence star in its stable Hydrogen burning phase nor the Earth are appreciably heated by gravitational collapse.  For the sun gravity does provide the pressures needed for, and contains, the resulting fusion processes that do provide the energy released by the sun. The Earth core is heated by the decay of radioactive elements and the energy released is in very near equilibrium with the energy lost to the surface and ultimately radiated away along with the energy received from external sources (overwhelmingly from the sun).  This has resulted in a stable internal temperature profile and surprisingly stable surface temperatures with in a very few degrees (<15C) for billions of years.[[Special:Contributions/162.158.126.76|162.158.126.76]] 17:17, 9 June 2018 (UTC)

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 ::Thanks IP, by using the 4 tildes OR the sign button at the top also a timestamp will be shown.
 ::VannaWho: What is messed up? What happens? And what browser do you use? I also can't see any problems. --[[User:Dgbrt|Dgbrt]] ([[User talk:Dgbrt|talk]]) 12:19, 8 June 2018 (UTC)
 The current explanation suggests that solar flares and volcanic eruptions are always quite benign. My interpretation of this comic, when I read it, was that volcanic eruptions can indeed be very deadly and potentially kill most humans (supervolcano, mini ice age... etc). But they are indeed rare enough that all humans currently alive and many generations to come are pretty safe from that risk.

@@ Line 15: / Line 15: @@
 I feel like the fact that without Earth's own magnetic field, which is generated by processes related to Earth being massive convecting system, protecting us from solar flares, the damage from them would be much worse, should be noted. Wait. Once again: I feel that following fact should be noted: The damage from solar flares would be much worse if we wouldn't be protected by Earth's own magnetic field, which is generated by processes related to Earth being massive convecting system. -- [[User:Hkmaly|Hkmaly]] ([[User talk:Hkmaly|talk]]) 05:04, 9 June 2018 (UTC)
-And so Randall's solution is to [https://what-if.xkcd.com extinguish the sun]... thus creating a safer world free from the threat of solar flares! [[User:Herobrine|Herobrine]] ([[User talk:Herobrine|talk]]) 03:12, 10 June 2018 (UTC)
+And so Randall's solution is to [https://what-if.xkcd.com/49/ extinguish the sun]... thus creating a safer world free from the threat of solar flares! [[User:Herobrine|Herobrine]] ([[User talk:Herobrine|talk]]) 03:12, 10 June 2018 (UTC)
 == New Misc Points (3 of them) ==