Talk:2254: JPEG2000 - Revision history

172.70.162.58 at 12:56, 29 January 2025

2025-01-29T12:56:46Z

172.69.194.101 at 04:01, 8 February 2024

2024-02-08T04:01:37Z

172.71.26.175: Added a comment about a link in the explaination

2024-02-08T03:32:38Z

Added a comment about a link in the explaination

JamesCurran at 21:44, 30 January 2020

2020-01-30T21:44:14Z

Kazvorpal at 17:57, 25 January 2020

2020-01-25T17:57:29Z

Kazvorpal at 17:56, 25 January 2020

2020-01-25T17:56:06Z

Kazvorpal at 17:55, 25 January 2020

2020-01-25T17:55:11Z

108.162.216.12 at 14:35, 18 January 2020

2020-01-18T14:35:59Z

141.101.98.196 at 17:15, 16 January 2020

2020-01-16T17:15:56Z

Thisisnotatest: Comment on use of JPEG2000 for a cartoon

2020-01-16T08:04:00Z

Comment on use of JPEG2000 for a cartoon

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:56, 29 January 2025
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	:Well, it worked, but was redirecting to a generic page lacking the definition. ;)		:Well, it worked, but was redirecting to a generic page lacking the definition. ;)
	:Anyway, replaced it with another link that (currently) defines the term. [[Special:Contributions/172.69.194.101\|172.69.194.101]] 04:01, 8 February 2024 (UTC)		:Anyway, replaced it with another link that (currently) defines the term. [[Special:Contributions/172.69.194.101\|172.69.194.101]] 04:01, 8 February 2024 (UTC)
		+	::Talking of Betamax, and pre-empting JPEG2000's millenial naming by more than a decade, I'm still holding out for {{w\|Video 2000}}'s inherent superiority (over ''both'' VHS and Betmax) to be recognised... I've still got a machine and a number of tapes (including 2x4hr ones), waiting to be used again. Just as soon as they reimplement analogue TV broadcasts once more! [[Special:Contributions/172.70.162.58\|172.70.162.58]] 12:56, 29 January 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 04:01, 8 February 2024
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	Randall is correct to not really care about the standard's failure, per se, except insofar as he feels sorry for it. The difference between the technical impressiveness of these improvements and their unimportance to reality reminds me of the VHS vs [[Wikipedia:Betamax\|Beta]] issue. Yes, Beta had the ability to reproduce sound and video of a higher fidelity, but only in a trivial sense indistinguishable to most people under normal conditions, whereas VHS was better at things that were indeed important, like being able to record a full two hour movie when Beta could handle less than one hour. The same thing happened with [[Wikipedia:OS/2\|OS/2]] vs Windows...OS/2 was purely object-oriented, a technical distinction that was completely irrelevant to real life, but required four times as much RAM as the typical brand-new computer came with, so it failed. Being able to save 32 bit color profiles and choose whether the compression is lossless is important to me as a graphic artist, but doesn't matter one whit to the typical user, who wouldn't even notice the difference. —[[User:Kazvorpal\|Kazvorpal]] ([[User talk:Kazvorpal\|talk]]) 17:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)		Randall is correct to not really care about the standard's failure, per se, except insofar as he feels sorry for it. The difference between the technical impressiveness of these improvements and their unimportance to reality reminds me of the VHS vs [[Wikipedia:Betamax\|Beta]] issue. Yes, Beta had the ability to reproduce sound and video of a higher fidelity, but only in a trivial sense indistinguishable to most people under normal conditions, whereas VHS was better at things that were indeed important, like being able to record a full two hour movie when Beta could handle less than one hour. The same thing happened with [[Wikipedia:OS/2\|OS/2]] vs Windows...OS/2 was purely object-oriented, a technical distinction that was completely irrelevant to real life, but required four times as much RAM as the typical brand-new computer came with, so it failed. Being able to save 32 bit color profiles and choose whether the compression is lossless is important to me as a graphic artist, but doesn't matter one whit to the typical user, who wouldn't even notice the difference. —[[User:Kazvorpal\|Kazvorpal]] ([[User talk:Kazvorpal\|talk]]) 17:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

−	The link to the term "betamaxed" doesn't seem to be working...	+	The link to the term "betamaxed" doesn't seem to be working... {{unsigned ip\|172.71.26.175\|03:32, 8 February 2024}}
		+	:Well, it worked, but was redirecting to a generic page lacking the definition. ;)
		+	:Anyway, replaced it with another link that (currently) defines the term. [[Special:Contributions/172.69.194.101\|172.69.194.101]] 04:01, 8 February 2024 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 03:32, 8 February 2024
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	Randall is correct to not really care about the standard's failure, per se, except insofar as he feels sorry for it. The difference between the technical impressiveness of these improvements and their unimportance to reality reminds me of the VHS vs [[Wikipedia:Betamax\|Beta]] issue. Yes, Beta had the ability to reproduce sound and video of a higher fidelity, but only in a trivial sense indistinguishable to most people under normal conditions, whereas VHS was better at things that were indeed important, like being able to record a full two hour movie when Beta could handle less than one hour. The same thing happened with [[Wikipedia:OS/2\|OS/2]] vs Windows...OS/2 was purely object-oriented, a technical distinction that was completely irrelevant to real life, but required four times as much RAM as the typical brand-new computer came with, so it failed. Being able to save 32 bit color profiles and choose whether the compression is lossless is important to me as a graphic artist, but doesn't matter one whit to the typical user, who wouldn't even notice the difference. —[[User:Kazvorpal\|Kazvorpal]] ([[User talk:Kazvorpal\|talk]]) 17:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)		Randall is correct to not really care about the standard's failure, per se, except insofar as he feels sorry for it. The difference between the technical impressiveness of these improvements and their unimportance to reality reminds me of the VHS vs [[Wikipedia:Betamax\|Beta]] issue. Yes, Beta had the ability to reproduce sound and video of a higher fidelity, but only in a trivial sense indistinguishable to most people under normal conditions, whereas VHS was better at things that were indeed important, like being able to record a full two hour movie when Beta could handle less than one hour. The same thing happened with [[Wikipedia:OS/2\|OS/2]] vs Windows...OS/2 was purely object-oriented, a technical distinction that was completely irrelevant to real life, but required four times as much RAM as the typical brand-new computer came with, so it failed. Being able to save 32 bit color profiles and choose whether the compression is lossless is important to me as a graphic artist, but doesn't matter one whit to the typical user, who wouldn't even notice the difference. —[[User:Kazvorpal\|Kazvorpal]] ([[User talk:Kazvorpal\|talk]]) 17:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
		+
		+	The link to the term "betamaxed" doesn't seem to be working...

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 Would a brief description of the .png format (more typically used for comic images) be appropriate? {{unsigned|162.158.78.70}}
-I was pretty sure that patents were the main problem with adoption, at least in time when .gif patents were problem. However, seems the patent status is getting better and it isn't helping ... meanwhile, WEBP, which is using similar technology, is gaining traction.
+I was pretty sure that patents were the main problem with adoption, at least in time when .gif patents were a problem. However, it seems the patent status is getting better and it isn't helping ... meanwhile, WEBP, which is using similar technology, is gaining traction.
-... which would also answer question of previous commenter: while brief mention of PNG might be worth it, mention of WEBP and similar alternatives would be more important -- [[User:Hkmaly|Hkmaly]] ([[User talk:Hkmaly|talk]]) 23:46, 14 January 2020 (UTC)
+... which would also answer the question of the previous commenter: while brief mention of PNG might be worth it, mention of WEBP and similar alternatives would be more important -- [[User:Hkmaly|Hkmaly]] ([[User talk:Hkmaly|talk]]) 23:46, 14 January 2020 (UTC)
 It's also used for [http://wiki.secondlife.com/wiki/Image_System textures in Second Life]. In fact, that page also states that decompressing JPEG2000 is much more processor-intensive than other image compression methods, so I guess that might be another reason for the lack of general adoption? [[User:EddyM|EddyM]] ([[User talk:EddyM|talk]]) 00:50, 15 January 2020 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:57, 25 January 2020
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	I was browsing a series of 70+ page PDFs that was a very high quality image scan, and the PDF browser would regularly grind to a halt for a second or two when trying to move forward a few pages. I eventually discovered that the images were embedded in JPEG2000. They were definitely small file sizes and definitely high quality, but it was just too much. I decoded the entire 500+ pages and re-encoded them as jpeg. Bigger file size, lower resolution, but scrolling was smooth as butter again.		I was browsing a series of 70+ page PDFs that was a very high quality image scan, and the PDF browser would regularly grind to a halt for a second or two when trying to move forward a few pages. I eventually discovered that the images were embedded in JPEG2000. They were definitely small file sizes and definitely high quality, but it was just too much. I decoded the entire 500+ pages and re-encoded them as jpeg. Bigger file size, lower resolution, but scrolling was smooth as butter again.

−	Randall is correct to not really care about the standard's failure, per se, except insofar as he feels sorry for it. The difference between the technical impressiveness of these improvements and their unimportance to reality reminds me of the VHS vs [[Wikipedia:Betamax\|Beta]] issue. Yes, Beta had the ability to reproduce sound and video of a higher fidelity, but only in a trivial sense indistinguishable to most people under normal conditions, whereas VHS was better at things that were indeed important, like being able to record a full two hour movie when Beta could handle less than one hour. The same thing happened with [[Wikipedia:OS/2\|OS/2]] vs Windows...OS/2 was purely object-oriented, a technical distinction that was completely irrelevant to real life, but required four times as much RAM as the typical brand-new computer came with, so it failed. —[[User:Kazvorpal\|Kazvorpal]] ([[User talk:Kazvorpal\|talk]]) 17:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)	+	Randall is correct to not really care about the standard's failure, per se, except insofar as he feels sorry for it. The difference between the technical impressiveness of these improvements and their unimportance to reality reminds me of the VHS vs [[Wikipedia:Betamax\|Beta]] issue. Yes, Beta had the ability to reproduce sound and video of a higher fidelity, but only in a trivial sense indistinguishable to most people under normal conditions, whereas VHS was better at things that were indeed important, like being able to record a full two hour movie when Beta could handle less than one hour. The same thing happened with [[Wikipedia:OS/2\|OS/2]] vs Windows...OS/2 was purely object-oriented, a technical distinction that was completely irrelevant to real life, but required four times as much RAM as the typical brand-new computer came with, so it failed. Being able to save 32 bit color profiles and choose whether the compression is lossless is important to me as a graphic artist, but doesn't matter one whit to the typical user, who wouldn't even notice the difference. —[[User:Kazvorpal\|Kazvorpal]] ([[User talk:Kazvorpal\|talk]]) 17:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:56, 25 January 2020
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	I was browsing a series of 70+ page PDFs that was a very high quality image scan, and the PDF browser would regularly grind to a halt for a second or two when trying to move forward a few pages. I eventually discovered that the images were embedded in JPEG2000. They were definitely small file sizes and definitely high quality, but it was just too much. I decoded the entire 500+ pages and re-encoded them as jpeg. Bigger file size, lower resolution, but scrolling was smooth as butter again.		I was browsing a series of 70+ page PDFs that was a very high quality image scan, and the PDF browser would regularly grind to a halt for a second or two when trying to move forward a few pages. I eventually discovered that the images were embedded in JPEG2000. They were definitely small file sizes and definitely high quality, but it was just too much. I decoded the entire 500+ pages and re-encoded them as jpeg. Bigger file size, lower resolution, but scrolling was smooth as butter again.

−	Randall is correct to not really care about the standard's failure, per se, except insofar as he feels sorry for it. The difference between the technical impressiveness of these improvements and their unimportance to reality reminds me of the VHS vs [[Wikipedia:Betamax\|Beta]] issue. Yes, Beta had the ability to reproduce sound and video of a higher fidelity, but only in a trivial sense indistinguishable to most people under normal conditions, whereas VHS was better at things that were indeed important, like being able to record a full two hour movie when Beta could handle less than one hour. The same thing happened with [[Wikipedia:OS/2\|OS/2]] vs Windows...OS/2 was purely object-oriented, a technical distinction that was completely irrelevant to real life, but required four times as much RAM as the typical brand-new computer came with. —[[User:Kazvorpal\|Kazvorpal]] ([[User talk:Kazvorpal\|talk]]) 17:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)	+	Randall is correct to not really care about the standard's failure, per se, except insofar as he feels sorry for it. The difference between the technical impressiveness of these improvements and their unimportance to reality reminds me of the VHS vs [[Wikipedia:Betamax\|Beta]] issue. Yes, Beta had the ability to reproduce sound and video of a higher fidelity, but only in a trivial sense indistinguishable to most people under normal conditions, whereas VHS was better at things that were indeed important, like being able to record a full two hour movie when Beta could handle less than one hour. The same thing happened with [[Wikipedia:OS/2\|OS/2]] vs Windows...OS/2 was purely object-oriented, a technical distinction that was completely irrelevant to real life, but required four times as much RAM as the typical brand-new computer came with, so it failed. —[[User:Kazvorpal\|Kazvorpal]] ([[User talk:Kazvorpal\|talk]]) 17:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:55, 25 January 2020
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	I was browsing a series of 70+ page PDFs that was a very high quality image scan, and the PDF browser would regularly grind to a halt for a second or two when trying to move forward a few pages. I eventually discovered that the images were embedded in JPEG2000. They were definitely small file sizes and definitely high quality, but it was just too much. I decoded the entire 500+ pages and re-encoded them as jpeg. Bigger file size, lower resolution, but scrolling was smooth as butter again.		I was browsing a series of 70+ page PDFs that was a very high quality image scan, and the PDF browser would regularly grind to a halt for a second or two when trying to move forward a few pages. I eventually discovered that the images were embedded in JPEG2000. They were definitely small file sizes and definitely high quality, but it was just too much. I decoded the entire 500+ pages and re-encoded them as jpeg. Bigger file size, lower resolution, but scrolling was smooth as butter again.
		+
		+	Randall is correct to not really care about the standard's failure, per se, except insofar as he feels sorry for it. The difference between the technical impressiveness of these improvements and their unimportance to reality reminds me of the VHS vs [[Wikipedia:Betamax\|Beta]] issue. Yes, Beta had the ability to reproduce sound and video of a higher fidelity, but only in a trivial sense indistinguishable to most people under normal conditions, whereas VHS was better at things that were indeed important, like being able to record a full two hour movie when Beta could handle less than one hour. The same thing happened with [[Wikipedia:OS/2\|OS/2]] vs Windows...OS/2 was purely object-oriented, a technical distinction that was completely irrelevant to real life, but required four times as much RAM as the typical brand-new computer came with. —[[User:Kazvorpal\|Kazvorpal]] ([[User talk:Kazvorpal\|talk]]) 17:55, 25 January 2020 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:35, 18 January 2020
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	Odd that Randall would use a lossy JPEG2000 image for a cartoon rather than a lossless one. A friendly reminder that JPEG is best for photography and is not intended for line drawings. [[User:Thisisnotatest\|Thisisnotatest]] ([[User talk:Thisisnotatest\|talk]]) 08:04, 16 January 2020 (UTC)		Odd that Randall would use a lossy JPEG2000 image for a cartoon rather than a lossless one. A friendly reminder that JPEG is best for photography and is not intended for line drawings. [[User:Thisisnotatest\|Thisisnotatest]] ([[User talk:Thisisnotatest\|talk]]) 08:04, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
	: That's his loss, then! [[Special:Contributions/141.101.98.196\|141.101.98.196]] 17:15, 16 January 2020 (UTC)		: That's his loss, then! [[Special:Contributions/141.101.98.196\|141.101.98.196]] 17:15, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
		+
		+	I was browsing a series of 70+ page PDFs that was a very high quality image scan, and the PDF browser would regularly grind to a halt for a second or two when trying to move forward a few pages. I eventually discovered that the images were embedded in JPEG2000. They were definitely small file sizes and definitely high quality, but it was just too much. I decoded the entire 500+ pages and re-encoded them as jpeg. Bigger file size, lower resolution, but scrolling was smooth as butter again.

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:15, 16 January 2020
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	Odd that Randall would use a lossy JPEG2000 image for a cartoon rather than a lossless one. A friendly reminder that JPEG is best for photography and is not intended for line drawings. [[User:Thisisnotatest\|Thisisnotatest]] ([[User talk:Thisisnotatest\|talk]]) 08:04, 16 January 2020 (UTC)		Odd that Randall would use a lossy JPEG2000 image for a cartoon rather than a lossless one. A friendly reminder that JPEG is best for photography and is not intended for line drawings. [[User:Thisisnotatest\|Thisisnotatest]] ([[User talk:Thisisnotatest\|talk]]) 08:04, 16 January 2020 (UTC)
		+	: That's his loss, then! [[Special:Contributions/141.101.98.196\|141.101.98.196]] 17:15, 16 January 2020 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 08:04, 16 January 2020
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	When I clicked on th3 .jp2 as ljnked in the Trivia, my tablet wanted to open it only in my (pre-installed bog-standard) ebook reader ''or'' GPS Essentials (perhaps confirming 162.158.167.184's comment, just above). But mention of JPEG2000 takes me back (25 years or so!) to a time a similar scare to the GIF patent issue had motivated alternatives to the 'public' common picture standard. And reminds me also of the "masking" technique used on (regular?) JPEGs, based upon keyword-hash shuffling/deshuffling of selected 8x8-pixel DCT units of a JPEG image (and of the hues apllied to the curves) to reversibly censor images, IIRC driven largely by Japanese censorship rules. Somewhere on an old hard disk I must still have the reverse-engineered 'solver' I wrote for that, written in Delphi... ;) [[Special:Contributions/141.101.107.144\|141.101.107.144]] 18:14, 15 January 2020 (UTC)		When I clicked on th3 .jp2 as ljnked in the Trivia, my tablet wanted to open it only in my (pre-installed bog-standard) ebook reader ''or'' GPS Essentials (perhaps confirming 162.158.167.184's comment, just above). But mention of JPEG2000 takes me back (25 years or so!) to a time a similar scare to the GIF patent issue had motivated alternatives to the 'public' common picture standard. And reminds me also of the "masking" technique used on (regular?) JPEGs, based upon keyword-hash shuffling/deshuffling of selected 8x8-pixel DCT units of a JPEG image (and of the hues apllied to the curves) to reversibly censor images, IIRC driven largely by Japanese censorship rules. Somewhere on an old hard disk I must still have the reverse-engineered 'solver' I wrote for that, written in Delphi... ;) [[Special:Contributions/141.101.107.144\|141.101.107.144]] 18:14, 15 January 2020 (UTC)
		+
		+	Odd that Randall would use a lossy JPEG2000 image for a cartoon rather than a lossless one. A friendly reminder that JPEG is best for photography and is not intended for line drawings. [[User:Thisisnotatest\|Thisisnotatest]] ([[User talk:Thisisnotatest\|talk]]) 08:04, 16 January 2020 (UTC)