Talk:2582: Data Trap - Revision history

172.70.38.69 at 15:37, 18 February 2022

2022-02-18T15:37:01Z

Tkopec: Trying to fix Wikipedia link

2022-02-18T11:47:42Z

Trying to fix Wikipedia link

Tkopec: Stanisław Lem invented this before, as usual.

2022-02-18T11:43:45Z

Stanisław Lem invented this before, as usual.

172.70.35.70 at 00:28, 18 February 2022

2022-02-18T00:28:21Z

108.162.246.62 at 19:56, 17 February 2022

2022-02-17T19:56:44Z

Barmar at 15:15, 17 February 2022

2022-02-17T15:15:01Z

KirbyDude25 at 13:40, 17 February 2022

2022-02-17T13:40:36Z

Nitpicking: Analysis

2022-02-17T12:49:02Z

Analysis

162.158.233.105: info vs data

2022-02-17T10:27:57Z

info vs data

172.70.130.153 at 10:16, 17 February 2022

2022-02-17T10:16:48Z

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	This reminds me of "The sixth sally, or how Trurl and Klapaucius created a demon of the second kind to defeat the pirate Pugg" from Stanisław Lem's Cyberiad (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cyberiad). Protagonists got caught by an information collecting pirate Pugg and escaped after providing him access to all existing information, which stunned the pirate. [[User:Tkopec\|Tkopec]] ([[User talk:Tkopec\|talk]]) 11:43, 18 February 2022 (UTC)		This reminds me of "The sixth sally, or how Trurl and Klapaucius created a demon of the second kind to defeat the pirate Pugg" from Stanisław Lem's Cyberiad (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cyberiad). Protagonists got caught by an information collecting pirate Pugg and escaped after providing him access to all existing information, which stunned the pirate. [[User:Tkopec\|Tkopec]] ([[User talk:Tkopec\|talk]]) 11:43, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
		+	:Oh yeah! That's funny, I read that book a few months ago. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.38.69\|172.70.38.69]] 15:37, 18 February 2022 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:47, 18 February 2022
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	[[Special:Contributions/172.70.35.70\|172.70.35.70]] 00:28, 18 February 2022 (UTC)		[[Special:Contributions/172.70.35.70\|172.70.35.70]] 00:28, 18 February 2022 (UTC)

−	This reminds me of "The sixth sally, or how Trurl and Klapaucius created a demon of the second kind to defeat the pirate Pugg" from Stanisław Lem's Cyberiad (~~[[w~~:The_Cyberiad]]). Protagonists got caught by an information collecting pirate Pugg and escaped after providing him access to all existing information, which stunned the pirate. [[User:Tkopec\|Tkopec]] ([[User talk:Tkopec\|talk]]) 11:43, 18 February 2022 (UTC)	+	This reminds me of "The sixth sally, or how Trurl and Klapaucius created a demon of the second kind to defeat the pirate Pugg" from Stanisław Lem's Cyberiad (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Cyberiad). Protagonists got caught by an information collecting pirate Pugg and escaped after providing him access to all existing information, which stunned the pirate. [[User:Tkopec\|Tkopec]] ([[User talk:Tkopec\|talk]]) 11:43, 18 February 2022 (UTC)

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	Similar to https://xkcd.com/2086/ imo.		Similar to https://xkcd.com/2086/ imo.
	[[Special:Contributions/172.70.35.70\|172.70.35.70]] 00:28, 18 February 2022 (UTC)		[[Special:Contributions/172.70.35.70\|172.70.35.70]] 00:28, 18 February 2022 (UTC)
		+
		+	This reminds me of "The sixth sally, or how Trurl and Klapaucius created a demon of the second kind to defeat the pirate Pugg" from Stanisław Lem's Cyberiad ([[w:The_Cyberiad]]). Protagonists got caught by an information collecting pirate Pugg and escaped after providing him access to all existing information, which stunned the pirate. [[User:Tkopec\|Tkopec]] ([[User talk:Tkopec\|talk]]) 11:43, 18 February 2022 (UTC)

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	Pretty sure this comic is another example of literalist perversion of the title. There are many things called Data Traps, but they tend to fall into two categories: Collection of data (digital, physical, benign, etc) where data is being accumulated for retrieval/use, and "gotcha's", ie possible mistakes in collecting, handling, or processing of data). The comic seems to be a play on the intersection of the two [[Special:Contributions/108.162.246.62\|108.162.246.62]] 19:56, 17 February 2022 (UTC)		Pretty sure this comic is another example of literalist perversion of the title. There are many things called Data Traps, but they tend to fall into two categories: Collection of data (digital, physical, benign, etc) where data is being accumulated for retrieval/use, and "gotcha's", ie possible mistakes in collecting, handling, or processing of data). The comic seems to be a play on the intersection of the two [[Special:Contributions/108.162.246.62\|108.162.246.62]] 19:56, 17 February 2022 (UTC)
		+
		+	Similar to https://xkcd.com/2086/ imo.
		+	[[Special:Contributions/172.70.35.70\|172.70.35.70]] 00:28, 18 February 2022 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:56, 17 February 2022
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	I fleshed out the explanation, adding explanation for the reason for data analysis and the apparent data equilibrium that's being implied. Thanks also to [[User:Kynde\|Kynde]] for adding some more clarification in that new section. [[User:KirbyDude25\|KirbyDude25]] ([[User talk:KirbyDude25\|talk]]) 13:40, 17 February 2022 (UTC)		I fleshed out the explanation, adding explanation for the reason for data analysis and the apparent data equilibrium that's being implied. Thanks also to [[User:Kynde\|Kynde]] for adding some more clarification in that new section. [[User:KirbyDude25\|KirbyDude25]] ([[User talk:KirbyDude25\|talk]]) 13:40, 17 February 2022 (UTC)
		+
		+	Pretty sure this comic is another example of literalist perversion of the title. There are many things called Data Traps, but they tend to fall into two categories: Collection of data (digital, physical, benign, etc) where data is being accumulated for retrieval/use, and "gotcha's", ie possible mistakes in collecting, handling, or processing of data). The comic seems to be a play on the intersection of the two [[Special:Contributions/108.162.246.62\|108.162.246.62]] 19:56, 17 February 2022 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 15:15, 17 February 2022
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	Done properly, analysis actually reduces the amount of information (not data) that you need to consider--that's the whole point. Rather than trying to comprehend thousands or millions of numbers, you can (for instance) reduce it to an average, or a correlation, or some other single number. Megan is missing the whole point of analyzing data. [[User:Nitpicking\|Nitpicking]] ([[User talk:Nitpicking\|talk]]) 12:49, 17 February 2022 (UTC)		Done properly, analysis actually reduces the amount of information (not data) that you need to consider--that's the whole point. Rather than trying to comprehend thousands or millions of numbers, you can (for instance) reduce it to an average, or a correlation, or some other single number. Megan is missing the whole point of analyzing data. [[User:Nitpicking\|Nitpicking]] ([[User talk:Nitpicking\|talk]]) 12:49, 17 February 2022 (UTC)
		+	:I think the comic is deliberately ignoring the fact that once you analyze the data, you don't have to think much about the original data. So this reduced information is added to the original information, and data just accumulates without bound. And even when you do stop considering the original data, it's not usually discarded, you keep it in case someone wants to verify your analysis, you want to analyze it in different ways, or combine it with new raw data. Excess data could actually have been a problem in the old days when it was stored on paper -- electronic storage his mitigated this; a single PC can now hold data than one would have needed warehouses in the past. [[User:Barmar\|Barmar]] ([[User talk:Barmar\|talk]]) 15:15, 17 February 2022 (UTC)

	I fleshed out the explanation, adding explanation for the reason for data analysis and the apparent data equilibrium that's being implied. Thanks also to [[User:Kynde\|Kynde]] for adding some more clarification in that new section. [[User:KirbyDude25\|KirbyDude25]] ([[User talk:KirbyDude25\|talk]]) 13:40, 17 February 2022 (UTC)		I fleshed out the explanation, adding explanation for the reason for data analysis and the apparent data equilibrium that's being implied. Thanks also to [[User:Kynde\|Kynde]] for adding some more clarification in that new section. [[User:KirbyDude25\|KirbyDude25]] ([[User talk:KirbyDude25\|talk]]) 13:40, 17 February 2022 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:40, 17 February 2022
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	Done properly, analysis actually reduces the amount of information (not data) that you need to consider--that's the whole point. Rather than trying to comprehend thousands or millions of numbers, you can (for instance) reduce it to an average, or a correlation, or some other single number. Megan is missing the whole point of analyzing data. [[User:Nitpicking\|Nitpicking]] ([[User talk:Nitpicking\|talk]]) 12:49, 17 February 2022 (UTC)		Done properly, analysis actually reduces the amount of information (not data) that you need to consider--that's the whole point. Rather than trying to comprehend thousands or millions of numbers, you can (for instance) reduce it to an average, or a correlation, or some other single number. Megan is missing the whole point of analyzing data. [[User:Nitpicking\|Nitpicking]] ([[User talk:Nitpicking\|talk]]) 12:49, 17 February 2022 (UTC)
		+
		+	I fleshed out the explanation, adding explanation for the reason for data analysis and the apparent data equilibrium that's being implied. Thanks also to [[User:Kynde\|Kynde]] for adding some more clarification in that new section. [[User:KirbyDude25\|KirbyDude25]] ([[User talk:KirbyDude25\|talk]]) 13:40, 17 February 2022 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 12:49, 17 February 2022
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	Megan is NOT "Thinking Cueball implies he wants to get rid of some of the data . . . ."! I have NO idea where that implication lies. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.130.153\|172.70.130.153]] 10:16, 17 February 2022 (UTC)		Megan is NOT "Thinking Cueball implies he wants to get rid of some of the data . . . ."! I have NO idea where that implication lies. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.130.153\|172.70.130.153]] 10:16, 17 February 2022 (UTC)
		+
		+	Done properly, analysis actually reduces the amount of information (not data) that you need to consider--that's the whole point. Rather than trying to comprehend thousands or millions of numbers, you can (for instance) reduce it to an average, or a correlation, or some other single number. Megan is missing the whole point of analyzing data. [[User:Nitpicking\|Nitpicking]] ([[User talk:Nitpicking\|talk]]) 12:49, 17 February 2022 (UTC)

@@ Line 4: / Line 4: @@
 :But the feeling I get is that Data begets data (by analysis of the original data) and then the data that is the analysis plus the original data begs to in turn be meta-analysed. Which then gives an additional clump of data... Trapping everyone in a potential N-meta-analysis loop.
 :(For those wondering how the entropy of this system works, it's the additional state info of the successive analysers, like the sunlight shone onto the biosphere, that prevents the system going 'stale' and degrading to successively shorter summaries that add nothing. You get to comment upon the prior analysis's choice of trend metric, etc...)
 :Well, that's my take, but I wouldn't know how to authoritatively - and succinctly - put that into the explanation. I could be entirely wrong, as well. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.90.173|172.70.90.173]] 09:34, 17 February 2022 (UTC)
 Megan is NOT "Thinking Cueball implies he wants to get rid of some of the data . . . ."! I have NO idea where that implication lies. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.130.153|172.70.130.153]] 10:16, 17 February 2022 (UTC)

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	:(For those wondering how the entropy of this system works, it's the additional state info of the successive analysers, like the sunlight shone onto the biosphere, that prevents the system going 'stale' and degrading to successively shorter summaries that add nothing. You get to comment upon the prior analysis's choice of trend metric, etc...)		:(For those wondering how the entropy of this system works, it's the additional state info of the successive analysers, like the sunlight shone onto the biosphere, that prevents the system going 'stale' and degrading to successively shorter summaries that add nothing. You get to comment upon the prior analysis's choice of trend metric, etc...)
	:Well, that's my take, but I wouldn't know how to authoritatively - and succinctly - put that into the explanation. I could be entirely wrong, as well. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.90.173\|172.70.90.173]] 09:34, 17 February 2022 (UTC)		:Well, that's my take, but I wouldn't know how to authoritatively - and succinctly - put that into the explanation. I could be entirely wrong, as well. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.90.173\|172.70.90.173]] 09:34, 17 February 2022 (UTC)
		+
		+	Megan is NOT "Thinking Cueball implies he wants to get rid of some of the data . . . ."! I have NO idea where that implication lies. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.130.153\|172.70.130.153]] 10:16, 17 February 2022 (UTC)