Talk:3039: Human Altitude - Revision history

211.171.109.74 at 23:42, 16 November 2025

2025-11-16T23:42:31Z

172.70.91.246 at 08:48, 31 January 2025

2025-01-31T08:48:04Z

172.69.70.199: Advising against discussing man-carrying kites

2025-01-31T04:28:05Z

Advising against discussing man-carrying kites

172.68.193.135 at 19:16, 26 January 2025

2025-01-26T19:16:12Z

Definitely Bill Cipher at 19:28, 22 January 2025

2025-01-22T19:28:16Z

172.70.91.245 at 13:55, 22 January 2025

2025-01-22T13:55:52Z

Regex user: add comment

2025-01-22T11:15:30Z

add comment

172.70.207.140: mir

2025-01-21T06:45:22Z

mir

172.71.148.59 at 22:19, 20 January 2025

2025-01-20T22:19:30Z

Rps: Gemini 11 flight 1,374 kilometers apogee

2025-01-20T17:01:21Z

Gemini 11 flight 1,374 kilometers apogee

← Older revision		Revision as of 23:42, 16 November 2025
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	After 1940, there was surely never again one moment where no airplaine was significantly higher than 1km above the ground. Not during the war in Europe and Far East (surveillance planes!), certainly never afterwards. --[[Special:Contributions/172.68.193.135\|172.68.193.135]] 19:16, 26 January 2025 (UTC)		After 1940, there was surely never again one moment where no airplaine was significantly higher than 1km above the ground. Not during the war in Europe and Far East (surveillance planes!), certainly never afterwards. --[[Special:Contributions/172.68.193.135\|172.68.193.135]] 19:16, 26 January 2025 (UTC)
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		+	> volcano
		+	JOOOOOOJOOOOOOOOOOOO!!! --[[Special:Contributions/211.171.109.74\|211.171.109.74]] 23:42, 16 November 2025 (UTC)

@@ Line 95: / Line 95: @@
 paragraphs should be 5-7. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.155|172.71.151.155]] 05:04, 19 January 2025 (UTC)
-Just in case it’s relevant, since there’s a few comments here about ancient Chinese man-carrying kites: I went deep down a rabbit hole and the evidence for them having existed is significantly flimsier than an initial Google search makes it seem. All of the sources eventually just lead back to two quotes from two ancient Chinese historians, both describing one single supposed incident. And the story fits the extremely common apocryphal framework of “here’s this crazy way in which this evil king was cruel.” There’s no other evidence at all, that I can find.
+Just in case it’s relevant, since there’s a few comments here about ancient Chinese man-carrying kites: I went deep down a rabbit hole and the evidence for them having existed is significantly flimsier than an initial Google search makes it seem. All of the sources eventually just lead back to two quotes from two ancient Chinese historians, both describing one single supposed incident. And the story fits the extremely common apocryphal framework of “here’s this crazy way in which this evil king was cruel.” There’s no other evidence at all, that I can find. {{unsigned ip|172.69.70.199|04:28, 31 January 2025}}
 Annotated the image [https://imgur.com/a/nQ3FZdi here]... Green line is "current absolute record" (assuming the truth of the plot), blue line is "highest height that will now always have someone higher" (again, going by the plot), red line is "record by a living individual" (''based'' upon the plot, and several historical truths I could discern, but probably getting to be as much speculative as the original joke-plot-with-a-passing-basis-in-fact). [[Special:Contributions/172.69.79.164|172.69.79.164]] 01:39, 20 January 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 04:28, 31 January 2025
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	11 paragraphs should be 5-7. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.155\|172.71.151.155]] 05:04, 19 January 2025 (UTC)		11 paragraphs should be 5-7. [[Special:Contributions/172.71.151.155\|172.71.151.155]] 05:04, 19 January 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+	Just in case it’s relevant, since there’s a few comments here about ancient Chinese man-carrying kites: I went deep down a rabbit hole and the evidence for them having existed is significantly flimsier than an initial Google search makes it seem. All of the sources eventually just lead back to two quotes from two ancient Chinese historians, both describing one single supposed incident. And the story fits the extremely common apocryphal framework of “here’s this crazy way in which this evil king was cruel.” There’s no other evidence at all, that I can find.

	Annotated the image [https://imgur.com/a/nQ3FZdi here]... Green line is "current absolute record" (assuming the truth of the plot), blue line is "highest height that will now always have someone higher" (again, going by the plot), red line is "record by a living individual" (''based'' upon the plot, and several historical truths I could discern, but probably getting to be as much speculative as the original joke-plot-with-a-passing-basis-in-fact). [[Special:Contributions/172.69.79.164\|172.69.79.164]] 01:39, 20 January 2025 (UTC)		Annotated the image [https://imgur.com/a/nQ3FZdi here]... Green line is "current absolute record" (assuming the truth of the plot), blue line is "highest height that will now always have someone higher" (again, going by the plot), red line is "record by a living individual" (''based'' upon the plot, and several historical truths I could discern, but probably getting to be as much speculative as the original joke-plot-with-a-passing-basis-in-fact). [[Special:Contributions/172.69.79.164\|172.69.79.164]] 01:39, 20 January 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:16, 26 January 2025
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	I was laughing so hard inside the moment I saw this comic. Well done, Randall. [[User:Definitely Bill Cipher\|⯅A dream demon⯅]] ([[User talk:Definitely Bill Cipher\|talk]]) 19:28, 22 January 2025 (UTC)		I was laughing so hard inside the moment I saw this comic. Well done, Randall. [[User:Definitely Bill Cipher\|⯅A dream demon⯅]] ([[User talk:Definitely Bill Cipher\|talk]]) 19:28, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+
		+	After 1940, there was surely never again one moment where no airplaine was significantly higher than 1km above the ground. Not during the war in Europe and Far East (surveillance planes!), certainly never afterwards. --[[Special:Contributions/172.68.193.135\|172.68.193.135]] 19:16, 26 January 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 19:28, 22 January 2025
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	Hmm, {{diff\|363143\|that edit}} did ''a lot'' of "tightening". And seemed to give up trying to tighten, by the end, merely chopping whole segments (it now gives the impression that there's just one alternate interpretation of the Title Text, instead of the several valid ones). Can't deny, some of the things I wrote in were excised, but I won't take it personally. Some bits seem random; e.g. it has lost the link to "hoist by one's own petard", whilst keeping the base phrase about gunpowder (strange choice, as the link doesn't add to word-count in that section), as well as now never really explaining why the (undocumentable) wind-blown record-holders are even significant. Could do with some (careful) editing back in. I admire the attempt, and I know it probably needed pruning from how it was, so I'm respecting the intention but pointing out that it might need a bit of selective re-adding (or paraphrasing) from the original. Leaving it up to less verbose types than myself, though (who are also not ''too'' laconic). [[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.245\|172.70.91.245]] 13:55, 22 January 2025 (UTC)		Hmm, {{diff\|363143\|that edit}} did ''a lot'' of "tightening". And seemed to give up trying to tighten, by the end, merely chopping whole segments (it now gives the impression that there's just one alternate interpretation of the Title Text, instead of the several valid ones). Can't deny, some of the things I wrote in were excised, but I won't take it personally. Some bits seem random; e.g. it has lost the link to "hoist by one's own petard", whilst keeping the base phrase about gunpowder (strange choice, as the link doesn't add to word-count in that section), as well as now never really explaining why the (undocumentable) wind-blown record-holders are even significant. Could do with some (careful) editing back in. I admire the attempt, and I know it probably needed pruning from how it was, so I'm respecting the intention but pointing out that it might need a bit of selective re-adding (or paraphrasing) from the original. Leaving it up to less verbose types than myself, though (who are also not ''too'' laconic). [[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.245\|172.70.91.245]] 13:55, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+	I was laughing so hard inside the moment I saw this comic. Well done, Randall. [[User:Definitely Bill Cipher\|⯅A dream demon⯅]] ([[User talk:Definitely Bill Cipher\|talk]]) 19:28, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:55, 22 January 2025
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	since it got removed in the last edit, here's [https://www.heavens-above.com/OrbitHeightPlot.aspx?Width=1600&Height=1000&satid=25544&startMJD=51000&endMJD=61000 iss height over time]. change the start & end mjd to zoom in [[User:Regex user\|Regex user]] ([[User talk:Regex user\|talk]]) 11:15, 22 January 2025 (UTC)		since it got removed in the last edit, here's [https://www.heavens-above.com/OrbitHeightPlot.aspx?Width=1600&Height=1000&satid=25544&startMJD=51000&endMJD=61000 iss height over time]. change the start & end mjd to zoom in [[User:Regex user\|Regex user]] ([[User talk:Regex user\|talk]]) 11:15, 22 January 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+	Hmm, {{diff\|363143\|that edit}} did ''a lot'' of "tightening". And seemed to give up trying to tighten, by the end, merely chopping whole segments (it now gives the impression that there's just one alternate interpretation of the Title Text, instead of the several valid ones). Can't deny, some of the things I wrote in were excised, but I won't take it personally. Some bits seem random; e.g. it has lost the link to "hoist by one's own petard", whilst keeping the base phrase about gunpowder (strange choice, as the link doesn't add to word-count in that section), as well as now never really explaining why the (undocumentable) wind-blown record-holders are even significant. Could do with some (careful) editing back in. I admire the attempt, and I know it probably needed pruning from how it was, so I'm respecting the intention but pointing out that it might need a bit of selective re-adding (or paraphrasing) from the original. Leaving it up to less verbose types than myself, though (who are also not ''too'' laconic). [[Special:Contributions/172.70.91.245\|172.70.91.245]] 13:55, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 11:15, 22 January 2025
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	It seems like the graph is ignoring USSR's [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mir Space Station Mir]. Per wiki, it was occupied for 12.5 years of its 15 year lifespan from 1986 to 2001. Honestly, feels like a weird thing to miss while including the ISS explicitly. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.207.140\|172.70.207.140]] 06:45, 21 January 2025 (UTC)		It seems like the graph is ignoring USSR's [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mir Space Station Mir]. Per wiki, it was occupied for 12.5 years of its 15 year lifespan from 1986 to 2001. Honestly, feels like a weird thing to miss while including the ISS explicitly. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.207.140\|172.70.207.140]] 06:45, 21 January 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+	since it got removed in the last edit, here's [https://www.heavens-above.com/OrbitHeightPlot.aspx?Width=1600&Height=1000&satid=25544&startMJD=51000&endMJD=61000 iss height over time]. change the start & end mjd to zoom in [[User:Regex user\|Regex user]] ([[User talk:Regex user\|talk]]) 11:15, 22 January 2025 (UTC)

← Older revision		Revision as of 06:45, 21 January 2025
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	In 1966 there should be a peak above 1000km, the [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemini_11 Gemini 11 flight], September 12-15, 1966, which reached an apogee of 1,374 kilometers. [[User:Rps\|Rps]] ([[User talk:Rps\|talk]]) 17:01, 20 January 2025 (UTC)		In 1966 there should be a peak above 1000km, the [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemini_11 Gemini 11 flight], September 12-15, 1966, which reached an apogee of 1,374 kilometers. [[User:Rps\|Rps]] ([[User talk:Rps\|talk]]) 17:01, 20 January 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+	It seems like the graph is ignoring USSR's [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mir Space Station Mir]. Per wiki, it was occupied for 12.5 years of its 15 year lifespan from 1986 to 2001. Honestly, feels like a weird thing to miss while including the ISS explicitly. [[Special:Contributions/172.70.207.140\|172.70.207.140]] 06:45, 21 January 2025 (UTC)

@@ Line 5: / Line 5: @@
 :The Apollo part of the graph implies an at least weekly, probably daily or finer resolution. Aviation unlikely reached 4.5 km above surface on a daily basis until transpacific high altitude airliners became a regularity well after WW2. Planes of the 1930s could achieve greater heights, but usually only attempted when moutains forced them to (so it was not height above ground) and high altitude Zeppelin bombers of WW1 did not fly on a daily basis, sometimes leaving week long gaps between campaigns. However, the pre-airplane lows are still wrong: Pole vaulting has been documented since ancient egypts for crossing of crevices, bodies of water, etc. giving a guaranteed minimum of 2-3 meters. Cliff jumping in the 10s of meters range is also likely to have occured daily somewhere on the globe long before the 20th century and I would not be surprised if some tyrannt created a phase of more than 100 m daily by intensive cliff throwing. (As with the ancient chineses kite observation flights, it might be interesting to extend this graph well into the past, at least up to Spartan postnatal parenthood planning.) [[Special:Contributions/172.70.250.194|172.70.250.194]] 16:06, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
 ::''Aviation unlikely reached 4.5 km above surface on a daily basis until transpacific high altitude airliners became a regularity well after WW2. Planes of the 1930s could achieve greater heights, but usually only attempted when moutains forced them to...'' The limit is the humans. Past 10k or 15k feet (~4.5km) they go loopy then pass out. Pressurized cabins are costly. Wiley Post flew past 17,000 ft (to 50kft!) in 1934 with a pot on his head, after two other suits split their seams. War forces high flight: the B-17 crews had oxygen bottles and electric heat suits; they did fly about every day but thin air was the least of their problems. B-25 was pressurized but not nice inside. The Constellation (the world's finest tri-motor) was one of the first shirtsleeve cabins, to  24,000 ft (7,300m), but was a very premium ride. The DC-2, DC-3, and DC-4 were unpressurized (a few test DC-4s tried it). Piston engine output tends to zero by 55k ft, even with supercharger. The real move to high altitude comes with turbojets (Comet is credited with first pressurized production passenger plane), Boeing 707, Caravelle, DC8, etc which often work better far above 20k feet. --[[User:PRR|PRR]] ([[User talk:PRR|talk]]) 20:09, 18 January 2025 (UTC)
 For the "Apollo bits", I actually have (fairly) precise data, but the question is whether the spiky bits resemble the reality at all. Here's a version with accurately positioned timestamps, but with the the altitude normalised. Launch is at bottom, time in lunar orbit is at top. To keep the data short I have removed the 'oscillation in orbit" of them all (except for 13, which ''just'' looped around and came straight back out again), and the track of the landers (as never really gets any ''further'' away, averaged over a lunar orbiter orbit) as these things aren't really isn't visible if overviewing the whole program. Blue=orbit-only, Green=orbit-with-landing, Magenta is 13's mission. All sat on a month-start scale (thicker lines are year-starts), for reference.

← Older revision		Revision as of 17:01, 20 January 2025
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	Annotated the image [https://imgur.com/a/nQ3FZdi here]... Green line is "current absolute record" (assuming the truth of the plot), blue line is "highest height that will now always have someone higher" (again, going by the plot), red line is "record by a living individual" (''based'' upon the plot, and several historical truths I could discern, but probably getting to be as much speculative as the original joke-plot-with-a-passing-basis-in-fact). [[Special:Contributions/172.69.79.164\|172.69.79.164]] 01:39, 20 January 2025 (UTC)		Annotated the image [https://imgur.com/a/nQ3FZdi here]... Green line is "current absolute record" (assuming the truth of the plot), blue line is "highest height that will now always have someone higher" (again, going by the plot), red line is "record by a living individual" (''based'' upon the plot, and several historical truths I could discern, but probably getting to be as much speculative as the original joke-plot-with-a-passing-basis-in-fact). [[Special:Contributions/172.69.79.164\|172.69.79.164]] 01:39, 20 January 2025 (UTC)
		+
		+	In 1966 there should be a peak above 1000km, the [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gemini_11 Gemini 11 flight], September 12-15, 1966, which reached an apogee of 1,374 kilometers. [[User:Rps\|Rps]] ([[User talk:Rps\|talk]]) 17:01, 20 January 2025 (UTC)