Editing Talk:1389: Surface Area
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− | FYI to whoever writes this: the Seattle reference is the Space Needle. [[Special:Contributions/108.162.221.65|108.162.221.65]] 05:03, 2 July 2014 | + | FYI to whoever writes this: the Seattle reference is the Space Needle. [[Special:Contributions/108.162.221.65|108.162.221.65]] 05:03, 2 July 2014 (UTC) |
Uranus is larger than all of these combined. Of course, it isn't on this map because it is full of gas. [[Special:Contributions/173.245.62.62|173.245.62.62]] 05:50, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | Uranus is larger than all of these combined. Of course, it isn't on this map because it is full of gas. [[Special:Contributions/173.245.62.62|173.245.62.62]] 05:50, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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::It'd probably hurt. As an ice-giant, the interior of Uranus is mainly composed of ices and rock. Jupiter and Saturn have cores of liquid metallic hydrogen. Also, the rock/ice isn't considered the surface of Uranus, because most of the planet's mass lies outside the solid inner layers.) [[Special:Contributions/103.22.201.239|103.22.201.239]] 09:28, 2 July 2014 (UTC) P.S. Even if it was only gas, a spaceship would probably find it hard to handle the temperature and pressure at the center of Uranus. | ::It'd probably hurt. As an ice-giant, the interior of Uranus is mainly composed of ices and rock. Jupiter and Saturn have cores of liquid metallic hydrogen. Also, the rock/ice isn't considered the surface of Uranus, because most of the planet's mass lies outside the solid inner layers.) [[Special:Contributions/103.22.201.239|103.22.201.239]] 09:28, 2 July 2014 (UTC) P.S. Even if it was only gas, a spaceship would probably find it hard to handle the temperature and pressure at the center of Uranus. | ||
:::As the gas giants contain a solid core, why is it the surface of those cores not included in the drawing? Just like Earth, Mars and Venus, they are still just solid with a (very thick) atmosphere. [[User:GadgetViking|GadgetViking]] ([[User talk:GadgetViking|talk]]) 23:55, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | :::As the gas giants contain a solid core, why is it the surface of those cores not included in the drawing? Just like Earth, Mars and Venus, they are still just solid with a (very thick) atmosphere. [[User:GadgetViking|GadgetViking]] ([[User talk:GadgetViking|talk]]) 23:55, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
− | ::::Because it is a core and not a surface. On Earth, for example, most of the planet's total mass lies below solid ground, which can be considered the surface of the planet. In gas giants, most of the planet's mass is gas and lies outside the solid layers. How can it be the surface of the planet when it doesn't include most of the planet's mass within it? | + | ::::Because it is a core and not a surface. On Earth, for example, most of the planet's total mass lies below solid ground, which can be considered the surface of the planet. In gas giants, most of the planet's mass is gas and lies outside the solid layers. How can it be the surface of the planet when it doesn't include most of the planet's mass within it? [[Special:Contributions/103.22.201.239|103.22.201.239]] 11:03, 3 July 2014 (UTC) |
:If the spaceship has not braked enough down it would burn up in the atmosphere. If it has it would get stuck in the core of the planet, where it would eventually get crushed, as the pressure would be brutal way before reaching any rock or metallic hydrogen. Although I did like the first comment :-p [[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 21:00, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | :If the spaceship has not braked enough down it would burn up in the atmosphere. If it has it would get stuck in the core of the planet, where it would eventually get crushed, as the pressure would be brutal way before reaching any rock or metallic hydrogen. Although I did like the first comment :-p [[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 21:00, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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And of course the earth is not correctly displayed: we have water which - in most cases - is not solid. -- jesterchen [[Special:Contributions/141.101.75.19|141.101.75.19]] 07:23, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | And of course the earth is not correctly displayed: we have water which - in most cases - is not solid. -- jesterchen [[Special:Contributions/141.101.75.19|141.101.75.19]] 07:23, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
: Water still has surface area. Edit: oh, I see what you mean now, from the title in the comic. I guess you have a point, but it's mainly there for comparison so it's not necessarily a mistake. --[[User:NeatNit|NeatNit]] ([[User talk:NeatNit|talk]]) 06:14, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | : Water still has surface area. Edit: oh, I see what you mean now, from the title in the comic. I guess you have a point, but it's mainly there for comparison so it's not necessarily a mistake. --[[User:NeatNit|NeatNit]] ([[User talk:NeatNit|talk]]) 06:14, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
:: Under the water there is solid bottom --[[User:JakubNarebski|JakubNarebski]] ([[User talk:JakubNarebski|talk]]) 07:01, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | :: Under the water there is solid bottom --[[User:JakubNarebski|JakubNarebski]] ([[User talk:JakubNarebski|talk]]) 07:01, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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::: But then it is not "surface" anymore... but you two have a point. I focused mainly on the title, not the image text... So forget my comment :) -- jesterchen [[Special:Contributions/141.101.75.19|141.101.75.19]] 09:12, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ::: But then it is not "surface" anymore... but you two have a point. I focused mainly on the title, not the image text... So forget my comment :) -- jesterchen [[Special:Contributions/141.101.75.19|141.101.75.19]] 09:12, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
:::: Water indeed has a surface, while gas doesn't. [[Special:Contributions/141.101.104.47|141.101.104.47]] 11:13, 2 July 2014 (UTC)Martin | :::: Water indeed has a surface, while gas doesn't. [[Special:Contributions/141.101.104.47|141.101.104.47]] 11:13, 2 July 2014 (UTC)Martin | ||
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Don't think it is strictly accurate to say that earth is included 'for scale' -- surely it is included because it qualifies to be on the map. Otherwise it's a bit like saying that Belgium is included in maps of Europe 'for scale' (as 'the size of Belgium' is a well-known unit of land area as in 'Amazonian rainforest the size of Belgium is cut down every week') -- Devonian Earache | Don't think it is strictly accurate to say that earth is included 'for scale' -- surely it is included because it qualifies to be on the map. Otherwise it's a bit like saying that Belgium is included in maps of Europe 'for scale' (as 'the size of Belgium' is a well-known unit of land area as in 'Amazonian rainforest the size of Belgium is cut down every week') -- Devonian Earache | ||
: The size of Belium is also famous for its reference in the Doctor Who mini-episode "Time Crash" (see http://www.chakoteya.net/doctorwho/CIN2007.htm) {{unsigned|Esp666}} | : The size of Belium is also famous for its reference in the Doctor Who mini-episode "Time Crash" (see http://www.chakoteya.net/doctorwho/CIN2007.htm) {{unsigned|Esp666}} | ||
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The map of Earth doesn't look like the Waterman Butterfly projection. If it did, the continents would be angled in toward each other, and Australia would be up in the corner. The only thing that is even similar is that Antarctica is shown in "normal" proportions rather than stretched across the bottom. [[User:Prometheusmmiv|Prometheusmmiv]] ([[User talk:Prometheusmmiv|talk]]) 11:41, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | The map of Earth doesn't look like the Waterman Butterfly projection. If it did, the continents would be angled in toward each other, and Australia would be up in the corner. The only thing that is even similar is that Antarctica is shown in "normal" proportions rather than stretched across the bottom. [[User:Prometheusmmiv|Prometheusmmiv]] ([[User talk:Prometheusmmiv|talk]]) 11:41, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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What's the area on the coast between Asteroids (1km+) and Triton? [[Special:Contributions/108.162.222.50|108.162.222.50]] 11:44, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | What's the area on the coast between Asteroids (1km+) and Triton? [[Special:Contributions/108.162.222.50|108.162.222.50]] 11:44, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
:Good question. Did he forget it or...? It is way to big to be his own asteroid Asteroid 4942 Munroe ;) And much smaller even than Vesta [[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 21:00, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | :Good question. Did he forget it or...? It is way to big to be his own asteroid Asteroid 4942 Munroe ;) And much smaller even than Vesta [[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 21:00, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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(My first contribution here!) About the Earth/water surface issue, I think Randall is talking about planets' surface, and then it counts both earth and water (like if it were a sphere) [[Special:Contributions/173.245.52.173|173.245.52.173]] 12:31, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | (My first contribution here!) About the Earth/water surface issue, I think Randall is talking about planets' surface, and then it counts both earth and water (like if it were a sphere) [[Special:Contributions/173.245.52.173|173.245.52.173]] 12:31, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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Regarding the table, perhaps it would be better to make a separate "Surface area relative to Earth" column? Or may be just a numeric order according to size? The scientific notation of areas does not sort by ascending/descending order very well. [[Special:Contributions/173.245.62.62|173.245.62.62]] 14:09, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | Regarding the table, perhaps it would be better to make a separate "Surface area relative to Earth" column? Or may be just a numeric order according to size? The scientific notation of areas does not sort by ascending/descending order very well. [[Special:Contributions/173.245.62.62|173.245.62.62]] 14:09, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
Also, the average adult skin is around 1.73 square meters. For a newborn, it is 0.25.[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_surface_area]. Very roughly estimating 1 sq. meter as the mean BSA, we get 7 billion sq. meters, or 7000 sq. km of human skin. That would be slightly larger than the area of either Palestine or Delaware.{{unsigned ip|173.245.62.62}} | Also, the average adult skin is around 1.73 square meters. For a newborn, it is 0.25.[http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Body_surface_area]. Very roughly estimating 1 sq. meter as the mean BSA, we get 7 billion sq. meters, or 7000 sq. km of human skin. That would be slightly larger than the area of either Palestine or Delaware.{{unsigned ip|173.245.62.62}} | ||
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Should there not be a pixel (or perhaps a slightly grey pixel) for Asteroid 4942 Monroe - area of about 1-3×10<sup>2</sup> Km<sup>2</sup>?? [[User:Esp666|Esp666]] ([[User talk:Esp666|talk]]) 16:34, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | Should there not be a pixel (or perhaps a slightly grey pixel) for Asteroid 4942 Monroe - area of about 1-3×10<sup>2</sup> Km<sup>2</sup>?? [[User:Esp666|Esp666]] ([[User talk:Esp666|talk]]) 16:34, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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Why are Sedna and Quaoar not included? I mean, Sedna is so fantastically far away that I can sort of understand not including it. But Quaoar is only 10% further from the sun than Pluto or Haumea, and it's actualy closer than Makemake! [[Special:Contributions/108.162.238.165|108.162.238.165]] 13:33, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | Why are Sedna and Quaoar not included? I mean, Sedna is so fantastically far away that I can sort of understand not including it. But Quaoar is only 10% further from the sun than Pluto or Haumea, and it's actualy closer than Makemake! [[Special:Contributions/108.162.238.165|108.162.238.165]] 13:33, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
:Probably because we do not yet know if they have a stable surface. They would thus be included in the Various or asteroids sections. [[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 21:00, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | :Probably because we do not yet know if they have a stable surface. They would thus be included in the Various or asteroids sections. [[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 21:00, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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;Sorting | ;Sorting | ||
The numerical column needs to be rewritten (preferably as two columns) in order for sorting to be useful. - [[User:Frankie|Frankie]] ([[User talk:Frankie|talk]]) 14:27, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | The numerical column needs to be rewritten (preferably as two columns) in order for sorting to be useful. - [[User:Frankie|Frankie]] ([[User talk:Frankie|talk]]) 14:27, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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: Perhaps this is the Earth's surface after all the bodies of water vanish? http://what-if.xkcd.com/103/ | : Perhaps this is the Earth's surface after all the bodies of water vanish? http://what-if.xkcd.com/103/ | ||
:[[User:Wwoods|Wwoods]] ([[User talk:Wwoods|talk]]) 21:07, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | :[[User:Wwoods|Wwoods]] ([[User talk:Wwoods|talk]]) 21:07, 2 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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I think that should be Buffalo Bill. Hannibal ate his victims, Bill sewed their skins into "clothing". --[[Special:Contributions/173.245.52.153|173.245.52.153]] 01:41, 3 July 2014 (UTC) | I think that should be Buffalo Bill. Hannibal ate his victims, Bill sewed their skins into "clothing". --[[Special:Contributions/173.245.52.153|173.245.52.153]] 01:41, 3 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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Doesn't this thing suffer from the {{w|Coastline paradox}}? If that paradox applies to suface areas of 3D objects, then the surface areas of planets and other objects would be infinite or very large. Even if that is not the case, I don't think the 4*pi*r formula would work properly. [[User:Theme|Theme]] ([[User talk:Theme|talk]]) 09:40, 3 July 2014 (UTC) | Doesn't this thing suffer from the {{w|Coastline paradox}}? If that paradox applies to suface areas of 3D objects, then the surface areas of planets and other objects would be infinite or very large. Even if that is not the case, I don't think the 4*pi*r formula would work properly. [[User:Theme|Theme]] ([[User talk:Theme|talk]]) 09:40, 3 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
:The difficulty would lie in stretching every mountain and basin into a completely flat surface, which Randall has ignored--You'd need a space iron[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clothes_iron] to do that, besides the space needle. Even the map of our continents would be rather different if the folded surface of every geographic relief was accounted for. Also, that is why very small objects (including tiny asteroids and dust) have been ignored. [[Special:Contributions/103.22.201.239|103.22.201.239]] 11:17, 3 July 2014 (UTC) | :The difficulty would lie in stretching every mountain and basin into a completely flat surface, which Randall has ignored--You'd need a space iron[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clothes_iron] to do that, besides the space needle. Even the map of our continents would be rather different if the folded surface of every geographic relief was accounted for. Also, that is why very small objects (including tiny asteroids and dust) have been ignored. [[Special:Contributions/103.22.201.239|103.22.201.239]] 11:17, 3 July 2014 (UTC) | ||
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