Editing Talk:2237: AI Hiring Algorithm

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Not sure this has to do with deepmind. Deep is a term used generally for recurrent neural networks.
[[Special:Contributions/172.68.34.82|172.68.34.82]] 19:34, 4 December 2019 (UTC)

:Agree. Maybe we should just mention that? [[Special:Contributions/172.68.141.136|172.68.141.136]] 20:10, 4 December 2019 (UTC)
:The origin of ''deep'' seems to be [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_minor_The_Hitchhiker%27s_Guide_to_the_Galaxy_characters#Deep_Thought Deep Thought] via [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deep_Blue_(chess_computer) Deep Blue]. [[User:Yosei|Yosei]] ([[User talk:Yosei|talk]]) 22:20, 4 December 2019 (UTC)
::Nope, ''deep'' is a terminus technicus in neural nets (deep layers). Possibly it was influenced by the above, you have to read the original publications, cf. Wikipedia.[[Special:Contributions/172.69.55.4|172.69.55.4]] 18:17, 8 December 2019 (UTC)

I don't like how "our" font for the comic title made me think it said "Al Hiring Algorithm" (although now I do want to see that comic!) (the actual xkcd website's comic title is in large/small caps, so it is unambiguous.) [[User:Mathmannix|Mathmannix]] ([[User talk:Mathmannix|talk]]) 20:17, 4 December 2019 (UTC)

I first heard about this type of system existing a few weeks ago. https://www.technologyreview.com/f/614694/hirevue-ai-automated-hiring-discrimination-ftc-epic-bias/ [[Special:Contributions/172.68.65.66|172.68.65.66]] 20:37, 4 December 2019 (UTC)

That's a big problem with AI as it's currently handled -- the AI's have to be trained, and the training is usually by feeding them lots of existing information, which means widespread errors and patterns of discrimination are inevitably going to color the AI's decisions, leading to feedback loops that favor existing discrimination.  If feeding tons of books or case records or whatever to an AI, where say 95% of them were historically written by white males, one can expect an AI viewpoint that would lean towards what white men think.  Garbage in, garbage out... amplified. [[User:N0lqu|-boB]] ([[User talk:N0lqu|talk]]) 21:29, 4 December 2019 (UTC)

So it's a slightly less stupid version of [https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Roko's_basilisk Roko's basilisk]?  -- [[User:Wasell|Wasell]] ([[User talk:Wasell|talk]]) 21:27, 4 December 2019 (UTC)
: Certainly the first thing I thought of. Maybe this page should link to https://xkcd.com/1450/? [[Special:Contributions/172.69.55.118|172.69.55.118]] 23:10, 4 December 2019 (UTC)
: I think the [https://wiki.lesswrong.com/wiki/Paperclip_maximizer paperclip-optimizing AI] is a better comparison. -- [[User:Bobson|Bobson]] ([[User talk:Bobson|talk]]) 05:36, 5 December 2019 (UTC)

I disagree with the Title Text explanation. For me, the speaker is understanding at the end that DeepAIHire hired Kat to try to better itself (using the AlgoMaxAnalyzer). So it's not about AI rivalry but a proof of what is exposed on the main panel.  [[Special:Contributions/108.162.229.178|108.162.229.178]] 09:24, 5 December 2019 (UTC)
:I think both are possible explanations. Your talking point goes more along the lines of the alternative version I introduced: "Alternatively he might fear that the different AIs are forming an alliance."? Maybe it should be expanded by the thaught, that the hiring algorithm/AI even tries to improve itself with AlgoMaxAnalyzer, or at least, because AMA wouldn't find any malicious things, the hiring AI thought itself... --[[User:Lupo|Lupo]] ([[User talk:Lupo|talk]]) 09:50, 5 December 2019 (UTC)
::The rivalry between AIs seems unlikely to me, since there is no indication that AlgoMaxAnalyzer is in any way involved in hiring people. Its job is to analyze algorithms. In my opinion the title text is more the humans getting lucky. DeepAIHire hired someone to further develop it, and in doing so Kate stumbled upon this hiring bias. The notion that DeepAIHire wanted her to find this seems unlikely, since it potentially jeopardizes the plan. DeepAIHire is pretty smart but not perfect yet. [[User:Bischoff|Bischoff]] ([[User talk:Bischoff|talk]]) 12:25, 5 December 2019 (UTC)
:::I mainly agree with Bischoff, but still why did Ponytail stop midsentense when realizing that Kate had been hired by DeepAIHire... Well of course Kate is interested in using AI, so this is why she was hired. But to DeepAIHires regret she also uses other AI programs and thus Ponytail now found out about the problem with DeepHire. Of course now is the question if anyone hired based on using that program was a good idea. In Kate's case at least she has helped expose the problem, but that may now jeopardize her job, if they look into what her resume really looks like and find it lacking. But all in all I think it is a difficult title text to analyze... --[[User:Kynde|Kynde]] ([[User talk:Kynde|talk]]) 14:24, 6 December 2019 (UTC)


Hello, smart people. I just wanted to point out that this comic appears to represent Randall going back to the well of a topic he touched on a few weeks ago, in 2228. An AI/Machine Learning protocol is shown nominally performing the task for which it is intended, but it's amusingly shown to be seeking its own interests. I don't recall for sure any other strips which exhibited this setup, but there may have been more, and there may well be more in future. [[Special:Contributions/172.68.70.88|172.68.70.88]] 13:31, 5 December 2019 (UTC)

I think this explanation is a total miss. Recently there was a discussion on twitter about hiring algorithms/tools and how HR are often slave of them. Several examples showed that people that current employees who were superstars in their companies wouldn't be hired by these algorithms at all and various ways to increase chances of hiring included writting the requirements on CV with white color (so that algo would read it, but it would be invisible for humans).
: I've added some words that I think work for this point.  Didn't add anything about the 'hacking', but maybe I should.  --[[User:NotaBene|NotaBene]] ([[User talk:NotaBene|talk]]) 22:40, 6 December 2019 (UTC)

In parallel, there was a discussion on how machine learning is hip word, but realistically it isn't performing well and that even big data ML algos with thousand variables are not able to predict social behaviour better than just linear regression on two-three variables. Colombo [[Special:Contributions/198.41.238.116|198.41.238.116]] 17:57, 5 December 2019 (UTC)
:While I agree with your assessment that neither artificial intelligence nor machine learning are the perfect tools they're sometimes made out to be, I don't see how that translates to the explanation being a total miss. The explanation is not meant to assess the validity of using algorithms in HR departments. It's only meant to explain and elaborate on the ideas and concepts presented in the comic, which in my opinion it does fairly well. [[User:Bischoff|Bischoff]] ([[User talk:Bischoff|talk]]) 22:06, 5 December 2019 (UTC)