User talk:FaviFake
Objects table
Thanks for replying. The current table in the main text looks good, but still it is a description or just enumeration of game objects, not an explanation (or in some cases: partly an explanation). Supposing we keep the current structure, it is possible to add explanations for the planet names in the Explanation column. For example, first sentence of the second paragraph is a good explanation for the Uzumaki planet's name. On the other hand, Andal has only a description (what it looks like and what features are present on the surface) and no explanation (that it refers to Animorphs series of books). There's also a question where one should put explanations of items and messages. Some do not need an explanation ('You found a stick'), but most do: what they mean and what they refer to, both in xkcd context (such as when there's a comic about the thing) and in general context. I hope you understand the difference between description and explanation. Maybe there's also some misunderstanding resulting from a language barrier; English is not my native language.
What is also missing in the table are many structures or objects found on the planets and, most importantly, dialogues or monologous of the characters, which contain many puns and references, and also hints for the player. There's simply no place for them in the current structure. Making more columns may be messsy. That's why I proposed making several tables covering different aspects.
Please take my remarks as proposals to improve the structure and not as a criticism or request for you to make everything right and fill every cell of the table. I think we need to create a clear structure for everyone else to fill in with details; but also to provide good examples to follow.
Technical remarks:
- In my opinion, the filename column is not needed, it does not appear anywhere while playing, it's in source code only. Better remove it to have more horizontal space for the rest. The names given to the planets by the editors of the explanation page shown in the Description column are fine.
- Coordinates are also not useful for a regular player, who does not use some Javascript addition/cheats, maybe remove it as well; textual directions in Explanation column are sufficient.
-- Malgond (talk) 19:59, 2 May 2023 (UTC)
- > Thanks for replying. The current table in the main text looks good, but still it is a description or just enumeration of game objects, not an explanation (or in some cases: partly an explanation). Supposing we keep the current structure, it is possible to add explanations for the planet names in the Explanation column. For example, first sentence of the second paragraph is a good explanation for the Uzumaki planet's name. On the other hand, Andal has only a description (what it looks like and what features are present on the surface) and no explanation (that it refers to Animorphs series of books).
- Hey! Yeah, that's the state of the table right now, and I 100% percent agree with everything you're saying here. All planets and items that need an explanation should be explained and not just described. I mostly just copied and pasted the "planet description/explanations" from the old list to the table: creating the table was way more painful than i thought. I was actually surprized to see that nobody explained what Andal referred to, but I don't know anything about it so more knowledgeable people will have to chip in on that
- >There's also a question where one should put explanations of items and messages. Some do not need an explanation ('You found a stick'), but most do: what they mean and what they refer to, both in xkcd context (such as when there's a comic about the thing) and in general context. I hope you understand the difference between description and explanation.
- I do! And I wish other people could help here. I'm not sure if you've seen it, but this is the banner i put above the table:
ALL ITEM EXPLANATIONS NEED TO BE TRANSFERRED FROM THE OLD PLANET LIST TO THE NEW TABLE
We are currently switching from a disorganized list (below, inside the green banner) to the new organized table, but the explanations for specific items are missing from the new table. Please help by copying the item explanations from the old list and adding them to the new table in this format:
The item message – ''Where to find it – Explanation, such as references etc''
Example: You found a cheese platter (Your tanks recharge faster) – Next to the cell tower – The cheese is a reference to 1234: Cheese
OTHER ISSUES:
- upgrades that end in "???" need to be replaced by the exact upgrade message shown to the user.
- the "Tiles (X, Y)" column for planet coordinates is empty
- As you can see, the explanations should be put right next to the items and messages. Unfortunately no one has started to add them to the table yet
- > Maybe there's also some misunderstanding resulting from a language barrier; English is not my native language.
- Your English is excellent :)
- > dialogues or monologous of the characters, which contain many puns and references, and also hints for the player. There's simply no place for them in the current structure. Making more columns may be messsy. That's why I proposed making several tables covering different aspects.
Almost all the dialogues are on the 2765: Escape Speed/Transcript page, so I guess they should be added there. I don't know if they're already here, I haven't looked at it enough
- > Please take my remarks as proposals to improve the structure and not as a criticism or request for you to make everything right and fill every cell of the table. I think we need to create a clear structure for everyone else to fill in with details; but also to provide good examples to follow.
- Yeah; i totally get everything you said. In my last reply I think I was a bit too rude for some reason, maybe it's because I just finished the table and was tired.
- >* In my opinion, the filename column is not needed, it does not appear anywhere while playing, it's in source code only. Better remove it to have more horizontal space for the rest. The names given to the planets by the editors of the explanation page shown in the Description column are fine.
- Coordinates are also not useful for a regular player, who does not use some Javascript addition/cheats, maybe remove it as well; textual directions in Explanation column are sufficient.
I was heavily inspired by the table in the 2712: Gravity explanation, which included these. I kind of agree that the filename could be removed, and the filenames could be added to the planet name or explanation, i didn't think about that. About the tiles, someone might use them someday, but if the column keeps remaining empty, i don't mind seeing it disappear
- I really liked your ideas, if you don't mind I'll copy and paste this discussion in the actual comic discussion page and see what others think --FaviFake (talk) 21:37, 2 May 2023 (UTC)
- Update: I found a way and added all the coordinates, and moved the planet filenames to the Planet Name column to make more space for the other columns :)
- Hi, what about dividing planets and objects like in my experiment? There's plenty of horizontal space for explanations and the entries are quite compact vertically. I also think about color-coding the different Types of game objects. -- Malgond (talk) 5 May 2023
- Hmm, I think it looks a little messy and maybe too complicated. Do any other comics have two different tables? Also, I'm personally not a fan of mixing items, landscapes, and people. I think most people reading the table are there to get an overview of the planets and what they contain. Do we really have to explain everything in such detail? FaviFake (talk) 14:09, 6 May 2023 (UTC)
- We do not have to follow other explanations too closely, we could use a new form if it seems clearer and better. The current form has no place neither for explaining items nor for dialogues/monologues. More columns could be problematic (specifically in today's world of high and narrow screens of smartphones). Should we explain everything? Well, it us up to collective "us". Personally, I would like someone explain a few puns/dialogues I do not understand.
- For now, there's only a handful of people still interested in somehow finishing the explanation for this huge comic. Maybe if we two can agree on some format we could put it in discussion page and ask for votes. (Discussion needs a cleanup, BTW). -- Malgond (talk) 22:00, 7 May 2023 (UTC)
- Hey, I'm back. I see you're enhancing your example table, and iI was wondering, do you plan to move your edits to the actual article after you're done and use the test to see how the formatting looks? Isn't it easier to just add them to the main page directly? Just wondering. If you want I can help you port them over :)
- Keeping the contents of the table on your talk page and then porting them over afterwards could lead to a loss of information added after you started editing your user page FaviFake (talk) 13:11, 13 May 2023 (UTC)
- Oh. I think the structure of the current table in the article is better than the one you've been working on: for example, it's easier to sort for items, is more compact, and is just one. Why don't you just add a "transcript" column like the table on 2712: Gravity to put what things and people say, and add the rest of the information on the respective columns? Personally, I think you're making it a little bit too complicated. FaviFake (talk) 15:26, 14 May 2023 (UTC)
Typo?
Rephrasing, yes, but I don't think this fixes a typo, or any other error. No problem with the change, but weird reason. 172.71.242.87 16:21, 15 May 2023 (UTC)
